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Thread: Events in Asia thread...

  1. #141
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    RollingWave's Avatar Senior Member
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    yeah, that's why the rumors won't die, because if it's something relatively minor shouldn't they just come out openly about it? though the PRC do have a track record of withholdnig high ranker's health issue until well after the fact.

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    Events in Asia thread...

    I saw this in another forum:


    The Other Shoe Drops: ChiComm Adventurism

    This is sort of breaking right now: http://hotair.com/archives/2012/09/1...puted-islands/

    It's being reported on HotAir via Twitter.

    The ChiComms have ships in Japanese territorial waters near some islands that they claim are theirs.

    Predictable? Some (commenters at HotAir) are saying that this has been predicted. That it was expected.

    I'm guessing that the ChiComms are taking advantage of the Middle East clusterf**k. I mean...why not?

    S. Kleine-Ahlbrandt ?@ska_kongshan
    MFA: In the next stage, China will administrate the Diaoyu Islands according to Chinese and international law. http://news.xinhuanet.com/english/ch..._123713561.htm
    Retweeted by Raymond Pritchett
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    52m Raymond Pritchett ?@Galrahn
    In Libya people set themselves on fire when upset. In China they burn their own Honda Civic's. Not a joke... http://shanghaiist.com/2012/09/14/ma..._banners_s.php
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    57m Mark MacKinnon/?? ?@markmackinnon
    Taiwan, which also claims islands China and Japan are snarling over, says its coast guard to "raise profile" in area: http://www.taipeitimes.com/News/fron.../14/2003542707
    Retweeted by Raymond Pritchett
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    57m Raymond Pritchett ?@Galrahn
    RT @cdrsalamander: BlogPostAlert: Well Played China; Well Played: When the world is looking left ... http://bit.ly/OmhfTS
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    1h Emily Kaiser ?@EKaiserReuters
    Japan pledges "vigilance and surveillance" in responding to Chinese ships. Sounds like what they say about the yen. http://www.cnbc.com/id/49027473
    Retweeted by Raymond Pritchett
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  3. #143
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    I have posted on that story in the posts above, the islands have been in pretty serious dispute since the 1970s (the key event being that the Americans decided to hand back Okinawa to Japan and these isles were included, the arguement mainly being that the Japanese only began to draw these isles into Okinawa when they started to go on their imperial binge so that was invalid. as the post WW2 settlement was supposedly to revert Japan back to pre 1895 territory.) and this current thing is only the latest of a series of $#@!e that has gone back for a few months already, so it's obviously not "hey look America is in a mess today let's start something new" thing.

    Meanwhile, Japan is in dispute of islands with all it's neighbors anyway. in this case they actually effectively hold the island so they have a considerable advantage. however it's the other way around against South Korea and Russia.

    It is more of a "hey let's all gang up on Japan at the same time" thing. and this includes several states that are very pro US as well (aka South Korea and Taiwan). so it's more or less a regional dispute. some unsettled busniess left from the Japanese imperial era.

    For example. the South Korean President a month ago openly said "the Emperor of Japan should come to Korea to make an open apology for WW2" that's actually a lot more insulting than most of the China / Japan back and forth thing.

    Japan's purchase of the isles is sort of an attempt to defuse a possibly even worse situation. where the Mayor of Tokyo would purchase the island. as that guy is well known to be a ultra right revisionist (the type that claims Japan were the victim / righteous crusaders of WW2)

    Also, the Chinese have send only coast guard level ships towards the islands. that's been a sort of unspoken mutual agreement between the 3 sides in this dispute (Japan / Taiwan / China) . that everyone only use para-military level ships at best. if someone seriously breaks that we're in trouble. so far. no one has .

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    RW, these "surveillance ships" are not military vessels, right?

    ---

    Six Chinese surveillance ships briefly entered waters near disputed islands claimed by Tokyo and Beijing on Friday, raising the stakes in a long-running territorial row between Asia's two biggest economies. China's foreign ministry said that the ships entered the disputed waters to carry out maritime surveillance and that for the first time China was carrying out a mission of "lawenforcement over its maritime rights".

    http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/49027621...ic/?ocid=msnhp
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  5. #145
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    yup, they are the equivalent of the coast guards in most other country. armed but not on a military level. all 3 sides in this dispute have essentially refrained themself and only used these ships in the last few decades. and it makes a bit more sense anyway. I mean military ships passing through other people's territorial water happens. (espiecally since this island is really far from the mainlands of Japan.) but coast guards only showup to guard in their own waters.... in theory.

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    Well Xi Ji Ping who has been missing for the last 12 days or so finally showed up in Beijing, but we probably won't know why he went off the radar in the last few days until much later.

    Meanwhile, the whole island dispute thing is getting pretty ugly, protest are again on the rise in China and this time it's getting a bit more nasty as some japanese civilians have been attacked and a hotel with a tour surronded and a rather ugly ensueing clash between civilians and riot police occured there.

    And if Japan has her hands full, it doesnt help that the man that was suppose to take over the position of ambassador to China in the next few days DIED in Japan. apparently he suffered a heart attack while walking on the streets... (the current ambassador was one of the few rare civilian to be named ambassador, as he was a famous businessmen and had worked in China for a long time, but he has made some rather.... pro China remarks on these issues so he's getting a ton of heat from back in Japan.)

    And of course, leave it to the Mayor of Tokyo to give even more inciting interviews on the issue. but hey everyone realize that it's a huge win for him no matter what, seeing that he's well on his way of getting his son on to the big seat as the next PM of Japan.

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    Oh wow...these things sometimes take on a momentum of their own. The strident nationalism is both populations will affect the supposedly more rational decision making of those in power.
    Whoever criticizes capitalism, while approving immigration, whose working class is its first victim, had better shut up. Whoever criticizes immigration, while remaining silent about capitalism, should do the same.


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    It would be easy for events to start spiralling out of control. Miscalculation is the handmaiden of war.

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    yes, but the timing is very nasty too, China is about to change guards. while Japan is going to run a big election soon as well. this whole thing started in part due to the mayor of tokyo want to start some wave to get his son into a better position to be the next PM. and he certainly did that.

    meanwhile, Hu is probably at a stage where he can't do anything major anyway. but the fear is that once Xi Ji Ping takes over, newly instated and still lacking in power base, he'll be forced to do something stupid by the hawks in Beijing whom have largely been contained in the last 30+ years.

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    and of course, it sinks to a new low when one side flies the Japanese imperial flag in their protest


    while the other invoke cultural revolution crap.



    Meanwhile, China is doing what I suspected they would do, aka mobilizing a pretty large fishing fleet to operate around the islands.

    Can't say that Taiwan probably won' benifit from both side canceling tourist trips to each other in masses though... and that busniess relationship freeze will also somewhat benifit us.

    Still, this reminds me a lot of Taiwan in the 70s and 80s in its final authoritarian stage. the combination of economic developement with a slow to react political reform process, ends up with a great deal of protest both domestically and against foreign powers.

    Of course, Taiwan's grips in the 70s were probably more legit, seeing that included everything from being kicked out of the UN and most of the world establishing ties with the PRC and then ending ties with us. this whole island thing began around that time too when Okinawa was returned to Japan along with these rocks. and then were incidents where US military officers shot a man he claimed was tresspassing on his lawn (not exactly the brightest thing to do there, especially given that his diplomatic immunity is debatable outside of the grounds of his station. which means he probably shouldn't be carrying a weapon to begin with given that Taiwan's own domestic laws explicatedly bar people from owning guns.)

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