Anti-Test 'Opt Out' Movement Makes A Wave In New York State

[Captain Obvious]

There are millions of students in k-12 and in college that are learning, setting goals, and putting in the effort. I'm one of them and I see many many others every single day. Most kids want to learn, and the ones that don't are typically just frustrated because there learning style may be different and so they shut down until that one teacher figures it out. I don't think it's fair to take a small percentage of the current population and make the future generations share their work ethic. You underestimate a lot of people.

ok - cool.

Your educational experience has been positive, you're learning from it. Ergo, there is no education problem in our society, everything is functioning normally.

[Peter1469]

I enjoyed college and my first two years of law school. I really did. And I learned the topics and didn't study for tests. I talk to old class mates and they don't even remember the material. It is funny.

My last year of law school sucked, because after working at a law firm I realized school only scratches the surface. There was much more to learn than school offered. I wanted out to get at it.

[Chloe]

ok - cool.

Your educational experience has been positive, you're learning from it. Ergo, there is no education problem in our society, everything is functioning normally.

Thats not what I meant

[Captain Obvious]

Thats not what I meant

I know.

I already assume that most of us here on tPF, you, me, Peter aren't the problem, we're the model.

[Ravens Fan]

Agreed, none of it's working.

It's not the systems fault either. Lead a horse to water thing.

I don't think you can put all that blame on the students though. School is boring, always has been, always will be. Kids these days are brought into a fast paced world. They are subjected to our addiction to instant gratification almost immediately, what else should we expect than for them to not want to be bored with school?

Kids are also just kids. They have not been out in the real world to see just how important that education is for their future. This has been the case forever. So do we blame the kids for natural actions, or place the blame on the parents and teachers who are supposed to guide the kids?

There are a lot of great teachers out there who have their hands tied by bureaucracy and bad parenting. When teachers are spending thousands of their own money towards their classes, something is wrong. When bad teachers cannot be fired to make room for good ones because of tenure, there is a problem. When parents cannot accept the fact that little Johnny ain't so perfect, there is a problem. The kids cannot be expected to want to do good in school on their own, it takes guidance from the adult influences. That is what has failed them, IMO.

[Captain Obvious]

I don't think you can put all that blame on the students though. School is boring, always has been, always will be. Kids these days are brought into a fast paced world. They are subjected to our addiction to instant gratification almost immediately, what else should we expect than for them to not want to be bored with school?

Kids are also just kids. They have not been out in the real world to see just how important that education is for their future. This has been the case forever. So do we blame the kids for natural actions, or place the blame on the parents and teachers who are supposed to guide the kids?

There are a lot of great teachers out there who have their hands tied by bureaucracy and bad parenting. When teachers are spending thousands of their own money towards their classes, something is wrong. When bad teachers cannot be fired to make room for good ones because of tenure, there is a problem. When parents cannot accept the fact that little Johnny ain't so perfect, there is a problem. The kids cannot be expected to want to do good in school on their own, it takes guidance from the adult influences. That is what has failed them, IMO.

And work sucks.

Smoking pot and playing video games is more fun.

Used to be you couldn't do that, you had to survive.

Now gubmint will take care of you, so why kill yourself over $#@! like skills and education?

[The Sage of Main Street]

I get that part.

I don't. It's not like they are preparing for something that has nothing to do with learning. Opponents are trying to make it sound like a typing test on just the vowels, which is the only way they could say that students wouldn't be learning how to type.

[Peter1469]

I did poorly in high school. I think I was near the top of the bottom 25%. One of the reasons that I went in the army when I was 17. After 4 years in the infantry I did very well in college and law school.

I don't think you can put all that blame on the students though. School is boring, always has been, always will be. Kids these days are brought into a fast paced world. They are subjected to our addiction to instant gratification almost immediately, what else should we expect than for them to not want to be bored with school?

Kids are also just kids. They have not been out in the real world to see just how important that education is for their future. This has been the case forever. So do we blame the kids for natural actions, or place the blame on the parents and teachers who are supposed to guide the kids?

There are a lot of great teachers out there who have their hands tied by bureaucracy and bad parenting. When teachers are spending thousands of their own money towards their classes, something is wrong. When bad teachers cannot be fired to make room for good ones because of tenure, there is a problem. When parents cannot accept the fact that little Johnny ain't so perfect, there is a problem. The kids cannot be expected to want to do good in school on their own, it takes guidance from the adult influences. That is what has failed them, IMO.

[Ravens Fan]

And work sucks.

Smoking pot and playing video games is more fun.

Used to be you couldn't do that, you had to survive.

Now gubmint will take care of you, so why kill yourself over $#@! like skills and education?

I don't disagree, but it's not the faults of the kids that these are the values they are taught...

[Captain Obvious]

I don't disagree, but it's not the faults of the kids that these are the values they are taught...

Nobody is responsible for who a competent, legal adult is but themselves.