"Slavery Denialism"?

[Ethereal]

Both del and Ethereal are making valid points. Obviously, or I should hope it's obvious, crimes committed by addicts are not necessarily incidental to addiction. In some cases that may be true but in many it's not. We all know some addicts rob and even kill to feed their habits. OTOH, most drug addicts aren't anti-social malefactors assuming a broad definition of "addict". The more committed users probably have a much higher rate of criminality than other demographic groups.

I understand the sentiment, but I do not agree with the inextricable connection he's trying to make between drug addiction and crimes committed in the context of drug addiction.

[Ethereal]

I understand his POV. Aside from crimes committed to feed an addiction I would also say everyone in your life is a victim in some sense. For example, I would suggest that an addict with children has victimized his or her offspring.

My use of the word "victim" is limited to the context of classical liberal conceptions of criminality where the overriding concern of the justice system is the preservation of an individual's equal rights.

Outside this context, one could certainly make the argument that a person is being victimized by another person's drug addiction, but the purposes of my argument, a "victim" simply means someone who has had their equal rights infringed upon.

[del]

If you agree to tell every drug addict in America that they're a criminal on par with people who sell babies and slash old ladies' throats, then it's a deal.

i never said that every drug addict was a criminal, but neither is addiction a victimless crime.

[del]

I understand the sentiment, but I do not agree with the inextricable connection he's trying to make between drug addiction and crimes committed in the context of drug addiction.

if the person were not addicted, they wouldn't need to commit crimes to pay for their habit.

why this is so difficult for you to grasp is mystifying

[Mister D]

I understand the sentiment, but I do not agree with the inextricable connection he's trying to make between drug addiction and crimes committed in the context of drug addiction.

I think you're right that that connection can't always be made. My only point is sometimes that connection is obvious.

[Mister D]

My use of the word "victim" is limited to the context of classical liberal conceptions of criminality where the overriding concern of the justice system is the preservation of an individual's equal rights.

Outside this context, one could certainly make the argument that a person is being victimized by another person's drug addiction, but the purposes of my argument, a "victim" simply means someone who has had their equal rights infringed upon.

Fair enough but, as far as I'm concerned, the damage addiction wreaks on society isn't something to be dismissed as "victimless" (i.e. a simple vice that is no one's business but the addict's).

[Cigar]

i never said that every drug addict was a criminal, but neither is addiction a victimless crime.

We never call Alcoholics and Prescription Drug addicts criminals.

[Cigar]

I dont know a single person that has ever said in front of me my entire life that they didnt believe slavery existed. I was never inclined to hang out with white supremist or racists. People can say anything, even when they dont really believe. There are no americans that truly dont believe slavery existed. They may be racists and ive never met a single person in my life that ever said flatly that he hated blacks either. Etheral made the best point and I think it personifies most of the feelings of most white americans. Yes there was slavery, that was ended before most were born. Theres blacks with fortunes all around everyone. Doctors, lawyers, politicians, sports figures. Entertainers. Theres alot of white people hurting out of jobs in welfare. Blacks might not like it but they are not viewed by the majority of whites as downtrodden and abused.

Are you aware how Black Ghettos were created?
Are you aware that as resent as the 1990's there were "Major" Banks and "Major" Realtors who were successfully sued for Housing Discrimination?
Are you aware how the vast majority on wealth in this country is secured and passed on?
Are you aware the Job discrimination still exist in this country?
Are you aware that education discrimination and segregation still exist in this country?

Yes there's has been progress, despite all efforts from sources to "take their country back".

But I'm not worried ... because for every step backwards ... there's still forward motion, despite all the efforts to prevent it, and that's fuel for much of the anger.

Change has and will come to the Country.