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Thread: The GOP circus is over. The clowns and elephants are all back in their cages.

  1. #71
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    Awryly's Avatar Senior Member
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    Quote Originally Posted by Calypso Jones View Post
    where do you get these ideas?
    Have you seen Romney's tax returns?
    Come sit down beside me I said to myself
    And although it doesn't make sense
    I held my own hand as a small sign of trust
    And together I sat on the fence


    Anon. Very anon.

  2. #72
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    Quote Originally Posted by Awryly View Post
    It's a quaint take that because some people in the top 1% change, they should not pay taxes.

    Not that many of them pay much in tax anyway.
    I didn't think you'd say uncle and change the topic so quickly!

    From Economic Mobility is Real:




    From What is income mobility and the definition of poverty?:

    Upward mobility from 1996-2005:



    Downward mobility from 1996-2005:



    Income mobility from 2001-2007:


  3. #73
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    GrumpyDog's Avatar Senior Member
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    Quote Originally Posted by Chris View Post
    Actually it's more than you think.



    Not if you bothered to follow your sources. [10] is about meritocracy, not economic mobility. Moreover, it does exactly what I pointed out is misleading, it looks at statistical groups, not individuals. Hell, you're always going to have a statistical top 1%, the point is the people in the group keep changing.

    I won't bother with the remaining sources since you obviously didn't bother to read them either.

    Well when they change from one group to another, their share of the Federal Budget will be adjusted to reflect the new group they are in. Its pretty much the progressive taxation model, except without all the loopholes for wealthy, and with means tested capital gains taxation. If in upper 5%, your capital gains will be taxed at say 50%, while if in middleclass, perhaps any capital gains tax could be as low as 5%. Low income, if investing, would have zero capital gains tax.

  4. #74
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    Quote Originally Posted by GrumpyDog View Post
    Well when they change from one group to another, their share of the Federal Budget will be adjusted to reflect the new group they are in. Its pretty much the progressive taxation model, except without all the loopholes for wealthy, and with means tested capital gains taxation. If in upper 5%, your capital gains will be taxed at say 50%, while if in middleclass, perhaps any capital gains tax could be as low as 5%. Low income, if investing, would have zero capital gains tax.
    You've just undermined the emotion for your tax model.

  5. #75
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    Quote Originally Posted by GrumpyDog View Post
    Whatever group the individual moves into, he will then have his contribution to the Federal Budget adjusted. It is basically the progressive taxation without all the loopholes for wealthy, and with means tested capital gains tax rate. So upper 1% would pay a capital gains tax as high as 50%, while next highest 5% would pay 40% and so forth. Middleclass, on average, would maybe pay only 15% or even less, while Low Income, if they invested, could have little or no capital gains tax, until they move up to next group.
    That's not how it's supposed to work, Grumpy One.

    As a reward for becoming rich, the new model is supposed to exempt parvenus from all taxes. In the name of equity and retaining a connection with their origins.

    It's in the Constitution.
    Come sit down beside me I said to myself
    And although it doesn't make sense
    I held my own hand as a small sign of trust
    And together I sat on the fence


    Anon. Very anon.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Chris View Post
    You've just undermined the emotion for your tax model.
    So fair distribution of burden to fund the Federal Budget is an emotional exercise in your opinion?

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    Quote Originally Posted by GrumpyDog View Post
    So fair distribution of burden to fund the Federal Budget is an emotional exercise in your opinion?

    Of course it is.

    Look how excited the rich get about it.

    Though i expect the posters here have no reason other than American pipe dreams to be thus emotionally so over-exercised.
    Last edited by Awryly; 11-21-2012 at 11:05 PM.
    Come sit down beside me I said to myself
    And although it doesn't make sense
    I held my own hand as a small sign of trust
    And together I sat on the fence


    Anon. Very anon.

  8. The Following User Says Thank You to Awryly For This Useful Post:

    GrumpyDog (11-21-2012)

  9. #78
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    Quote Originally Posted by Awryly View Post
    Of course it is.

    Look how excited the rich get about it.

    Though i expect the posters here have no reason other than American pipe dreams to be thus emotionally so over-exercised.
    It must have been the use of the word "progressive" which is translated as "emotional" in the How to
    Interpret Liberalism, A Guide for Conservatives (latest post Romney Edition).

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    Quote Originally Posted by GrumpyDog View Post
    It must have been the use of the word "progressive" which is translated as "emotional" in the How to
    Interpret Liberalism, A Guide for Conservatives (latest post Romney Edition).
    "Progressive" really excites them.

    "Neanderthal" not so much.
    Come sit down beside me I said to myself
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    I held my own hand as a small sign of trust
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    Quote Originally Posted by GrumpyDog View Post
    So fair distribution of burden to fund the Federal Budget is an emotional exercise in your opinion?
    So I see like wryly you prefer to change the topic.

    No, that is not what I said at all. What I said was you undermined your emotional argument.

    Emotional argument? Yes, you and wryly thought you had a nice pity the poor argument. But your pitiful poor were just a statistical abstraction, and not real people because individuals have economic mobility.

    Change the topic if you like but your prior argument fell flat on its pitiful face.

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