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Thread: How ‘Antifa’ Mirrors the ‘Alt-Right’

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    How ‘Antifa’ Mirrors the ‘Alt-Right’

    I've been making the case that Antifa or the Alt-Left and the Alt-Right share group identity politics. Here another similarity is brought to light, How ‘Antifa’ Mirrors the ‘Alt-Right’

    Behind the rhetoric of the “alt-right” about white nativism and protecting American traditions, history and Christian values is the lust for violence. Behind the rhetoric of antifa, the Black Bloc and the so-called “alt-left” about capitalism, racism, state repression and corporate power is the same lust for violence.

    The two opposing groups, largely made up of people who have been cast aside by the cruelty of corporate capitalism, have embraced holy war. Their lives, battered by economic misery and social marginalization, have suddenly been filled with meaning. They hold themselves up as the vanguard of the oppressed. They arrogate to themselves the right to use force to silence those they define as the enemy. They sanctify anger. They are infected with the dark, adrenaline-driven urge for confrontation that arises among the disenfranchised when a democracy ceases to function. They are separated, as Sigmund Freud wrote of those who engage in fratricide, by the “narcissism of minor differences.” They mirror each other, not only ideologically but also physically—armed and dressed in black, the color of fascism and the color of death.

    It was inevitable that we would reach this point. The corporate state has seized and corrupted all democratic institutions, including the two main political parties, to serve the interests of corporate power and maximize global corporate profits. There is no justice in the courts. There is no possibility for reform in the legislative bodies. The executive branch is a dysfunctional mess headed by a narcissistic kleptocrat, con artist and pathological liar. Money has replaced the vote. The consent of the governed is a joke. Our most basic constitutional rights, including the rights to privacy and due process, have been taken from us by judicial fiat. The economically marginalized, now a majority of the country, have been rendered invisible by a corporate media dominated by highly paid courtiers spewing out meaningless political and celebrity gossip and trivia as if it were news. The corporate state, unimpeded, is pillaging and looting the carcass of the country and government, along with the natural world, for the personal gain of the 1 percent. It daily locks away in cages the poor, especially poor people of color, discarding the vulnerable as human refuse.

    ...Many in the feckless and bankrupt liberal class, deeply complicit in the corporate assault on the country and embracing the dead end of identity politics, will seek to regain credibility by defending the violence by groups such as antifa. Natasha Lennard, for example, in The Nation calls the “video of neo-Nazi Richard Spencer getting punched in the face” an act of “kinetic beauty.” She writes “if we recognize fascism in Trump’s ascendance, our response must be anti-fascist in nature. The history of anti-fascist action is not one of polite protest, nor failed appeals to reasoned debate with racists, but direct, aggressive confrontation.”

    This violence-as-beauty rhetoric is at the core of these movements. It saturates the vocabulary of the right-wing corporate oligarchs, including Donald Trump. Talk like this poisons national discourse. It dehumanizes whole segments of the population. It shuts out those who speak with nuance and compassion, especially when they attempt to explain the motives and conditions of opponents. It thrusts the society into a binary and demented universe of them and us. It elevates violence to the highest aesthetic. It eschews self-criticism and self-reflection. It is the prelude to widespread suffering and death. And that, I fear, is where we are headed.
    One needs to look past this author's reversion to anti-capitalist Marxism and class oppression of a time gone by to get what he's saying about post-modern neo-Marxist left and right, er, alt-left and alt-right.
    Tradition is not the worship of ashes, but the preservation of fire. ― Gustav Mahler

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    Quote Originally Posted by Chris View Post
    I've been making the case that Antifa or the Alt-Left and the Alt-Right share group identity politics. Here another similarity is brought to light, How ‘Antifa’ Mirrors the ‘Alt-Right’



    One needs to look past this author's reversion to anti-capitalist Marxism and class oppression of a time gone by to get what he's saying about post-modern neo-Marxist left and right, er, alt-left and alt-right.
    It's still a bunch of nonsense written well.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Captdon View Post
    It's still a bunch of nonsense written well.
    Nah, I thought

    The two opposing groups, largely made up of people who have been cast aside by the cruelty of corporate capitalism, have embraced holy war. Their lives, battered by economic misery and social marginalization, have suddenly been filled with meaning. They hold themselves up as the vanguard of the oppressed. They arrogate to themselves the right to use force to silence those they define as the enemy. They sanctify anger. They are infected with the dark, adrenaline-driven urge for confrontation that arises among the disenfranchised when a democracy ceases to function. They are separated, as Sigmund Freud wrote of those who engage in fratricide, by the “narcissism of minor differences.” They mirror each other, not only ideologically but also physically—armed and dressed in black, the color of fascism and the color of death.
    was spot on. It's full of Marxist oppression nonsense but still very well describes how both the alt-let and the alt-right view things.

    THis should be unsurprising for the alt-left but I''ve read enough of the alt-right to believe it fits them as well.
    Tradition is not the worship of ashes, but the preservation of fire. ― Gustav Mahler

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    The alt right has a deplorable message. Antifa is a violent hate group. Both of them represent a fraction of the population, and if the media would stfu about it all, it would probably go away.

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    Just since I have been aware of the alt-right, how the media describes them is reminiscent of how the media portrays the Tea Party. It is an ever-shifting description that does not match the original.

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    When extremism takes on populist support, it is a definite symptom of a divided society. Extremism is never isolated to one side or the other; both sides tend to grow proportionately in response to each other. While the vast majority tend to lie in between either extreme, the extreme represent the visible manifestation and reflection of society's political fears and suspicions. In our society today we have agents of fear, represented by the media, who feed the angst for mercantile purposes. They are no longer happy with just reporting and discussing the actual news, they fabricate the news by subjecting the population to talking heads who are deliberately inflammatory in order to create division and disharmony.
    In quoting my post, you affirm and agree that you have not been goaded, provoked, emotionally manipulated or otherwise coerced into responding.



    "The difference between what we do and what we are capable of doing would suffice to solve most of the world’s problems.”
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dr. Who View Post
    When extremism takes on populist support, it is a definite symptom of a divided society. Extremism is never isolated to one side or the other; both sides tend to grow proportionately in response to each other. While the vast majority tend to lie in between either extreme, the extreme represent the visible manifestation and reflection of society's political fears and suspicions. In our society today we have agents of fear, represented by the media, who feed the angst for mercantile purposes. They are no longer happy with just reporting and discussing the actual news, they fabricate the news by subjecting the population to talking heads who are deliberately inflammatory in order to create division and disharmony.
    When extremism takes on populist support, it is a definite symptom of a divided society.
    Say what? Populism by definition "seeking to represent the interests of ordinary people." So how can that be seen as equivalent to extremism?

    And divided? Both the alt-right and the alt-left play group identity politics. And according to the Marxist author of the OP, both struggle against capitalist oppression. In this they are not divided.

    If initial premises are wrong, what's inferred from them must necessarily but by pure accident be wrong.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Chris View Post
    Say what? Populism by definition "seeking to represent the interests of ordinary people." So how can that be seen as equivalent to extremism?

    And divided? Both the alt-right and the alt-left play group identity politics. And according to the Marxist author of the OP, both struggle against capitalist oppression. In this they are not divided.

    If initial premises are wrong, what's inferred from them must necessarily but by pure accident be wrong.
    With what are you actually disagreeing? That there can be populism both within the left and right? That each side can produce extremists? That both sides can be sucked into identity politics? That both sides are being played by the same puppet masters? Can't we discuss anything without invoking scare words like Marxism, Fascism or any other "ism"?
    In quoting my post, you affirm and agree that you have not been goaded, provoked, emotionally manipulated or otherwise coerced into responding.



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    Quote Originally Posted by Dr. Who View Post
    With what are you actually disagreeing? That there can be populism both within the left and right? That each side can produce extremists? That both sides can be sucked into identity politics? That both sides are being played by the same puppet masters? Can't we discuss anything without invoking scare words like Marxism, Fascism or any other "ism"?
    Right. Populism is a tactic. Not an ideology.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dr. Who View Post
    With what are you actually disagreeing? That there can be populism both within the left and right? That each side can produce extremists? That both sides can be sucked into identity politics? That both sides are being played by the same puppet masters? Can't we discuss anything without invoking scare words like Marxism, Fascism or any other "ism"?
    The extremist alt-right neo-Nazis and alt-left Antifa are populists.

    Surely there are left and right populists, take Trump, please.


    Yes, part of my argument that the alt-left and alt-right are similar is based on their both engaging in group identity politics. But that's not populist.

    The author of the OP article engage in old style Marxist arguments about oppression.


    "or any other 'ism'?" Like populism?
    Tradition is not the worship of ashes, but the preservation of fire. ― Gustav Mahler

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