Mattis’s Last Stand Is Iran
Actually, the premise of this thread is false. Mattis’ Last stand? Huh? WTF?
Underestimated ISIS I believe an understatement. But you underestimated al-Qaeda as we all did, so, how many lessons need to be pounded in, donttread? Your viewpoints absolutely immobile. You refused to even consider anyone else's viewpoints, in fact, mocked most of them that were in opposition to yours. And you need not be reduced to "I probably said"...I supplied links showing you exactly what you 'said'...that is repeated above. That this is all our fault. But you are correct about one thing there, donttread. Despite our covert military operations, ISIS continued to grow transforming into an international terrorist threat while you urged we leave them to their devices. Let em tear the world apart.
I'm not discussing Ruby Ridge, Waco, or Fast and Furious, Mr. I change the subject when I don't know.Another "ah shucks we're just incompetent " excuse from the feds like Ruby Ridge , Waco, Fast and $#@!ed up , "too big to fail" etc. We were in the ME running ops in country after country , we'd just spent what a trillion "fixing the ME" For those who would "welcome us a liberators"? We spent huge amounts of money on intel. And yet none of it, the money, the intel, the intervention, our noses being everywhere in the region stopped ISIS from growing more powerful than the groups we attacked the wrong country to deal with. None of it worked and you just recommend more of the same? Sure keep chasing failed policy it's what our government does best and what you continuously support. So
Extremely difficult to estimate. But a great question, donttread, because it reveals the core of your underestimation you speak to above. You refused to accept any other reality, ISIS was the US' creation. Period. But ISIS is created within Syria and realities in Syria. As it mowed its way through Iraq, it added AQI and al-Qaeda affiliates. But it's base of operations and where it came from resides in Syria. Where influences from Turkey and Russia to Syria and Iran were involved. Where Hezbollah and Hamas, Iranian Elite units, the Syrian Army, and a host of anti-Assad interests, the US being but one of them. You don't read, donttread.1) How much effect of ISIS growth do you think came from western policy in the region?
It grew so strong taking full advantage of the Syrian Civil War, donttread. It grew with the aid of the chaos called by all the influences I listed above. And it happened under our watchful eye...that included this forum's watchful eye.....donttread. One Member here urged overt military force long before Paris. That ISIS had grown from Syria and despite US covert operations and limited assistance to Iraq's military, the Islamic State was able to criss cross the Levant. Right under our 'watchful eye.' That saw clearly what was going on, you'll remember you mocked what the eye was obviously seeing, donttread. When shown this organizations recruitment capabilities, what threats they posed we here in the West...you mocked that as well.2) How did ISIS grow so strong given our massive presence in the ME? I know our presence was not as all out as you would of liked to see, but it was massive and widespread . So how did that happen under our "watchful eye"?
Remember, we had withdrawn from Iraq. We didn't have the resources to confront IS with covert operations. And when we finally did engage the Islamic State directly. When we sent thousands of US ground troops, heavy artillery, massive drone and air operations...that is what extracted ISIS. The very strategy you, Ethereal, and Peter vehemently opposed is what was always required.
Lastly donttread, isn't it nice when you can get questions answered? You detailed out two questions there.....but taking this to process for one moment...the fact that you boldly ask questions and then refuse to give answers to questions given you has been much of the reason I get so much entertainment out of schooling the shiit out of your opinions. Your refusal to move off your viewpoint. Stubborn denial of reality, refusing to read or research. Firing questions off expecting answers from others when never affording them yourself.
Reason I added you in here, donttread. Because you were wrong regarding the Islamic State. In fact, not even f'n close.
Obviously, you must learn from your mistakes, Peter. And from those of your contemporaries as well. The two other peas in your pod of error concerning the threat ISIS presented blew these analyses as badly as you did. Live and learn...from your mistakes. Especially form those that press beyond mistake and leap into the realm of blatant error. Such as your ISIS analysis for yourself and the other two rocket scientists.
No. That IS wouldn't be recognizable by November of 2015. That they didn't present a national security threat to the US or Western Europe. That their differences extended far beyond their common denominators with organizations such as al-Qaeda. That we had no interests in the outcomes in Syria. That we shouldn't arm and facilitate the Iraq Army against this growing threat. You know errors like that, Peter. That they'd be outright rejected by Sunni tribes in Anbar. That US overt action wouldn't be a game changer unless we were willing to commit "100,000 US boots on the ground".That we can save Iraq when Iraq had a corrupt government that actually caused the infestation of ISIL?
You'll remember that one always threw me for the proverbial loop...…..that this "sideshow" would in fact require no less than 100,000 US troops to defeat. That the chaos that was actually making us safer, was in fact going to require an entire American Army to throw back.Go Walt yourself.
And Paris occurred. The morning after, the tent here at Neocon headquarters explodes with clearance requests. Permissions to enter and be counted. The sentry at the tent's gate....reminded those asking for entry what the Neocon Tent was engaged upon. Direct, overt, US military engagement by the US military against ISIS forces in Iraq and Syria. The entire French Government showed up first. Followed by that bastion of liberal apathy and refusal to get involved, the British Parliament. The Sentry makes sure these two entities now favor direct military strikes in Iraq and Syria.....overt(that is specifically US direct boots on the ground, the thousands of US personnel needed to defeat ISIS that was so vehemently opposed by Peter1469, donttread, and Ethereal) military confrontation. Who is behind the British Parliament, none other than the Obama Administration. Wait a second....who is the lone ranger standing off to the side trying to sneak into the Neocon tent without being seen.
Peter1469.