Members banned from this thread: spunkloaf


User Tag List

+ Reply to Thread
Page 1 of 16 1234511 ... LastLast
Results 1 to 10 of 151

Thread: The Roots of Liberal Morality

  1. #1
    Points: 668,262, Level: 100
    Level completed: 0%, Points required for next Level: 0
    Overall activity: 99.8%
    Achievements:
    SocialRecommendation Second ClassYour first GroupOverdrive50000 Experience PointsTagger First ClassVeteran
    Awards:
    Discussion Ender
    Chris's Avatar Senior Member
    Karma
    433960
    Join Date
    Feb 2012
    Posts
    198,207
    Points
    668,262
    Level
    100
    Thanks Given
    32,237
    Thanked 81,549x in 55,058 Posts
    Mentioned
    2014 Post(s)
    Tagged
    2 Thread(s)

    The Roots of Liberal Morality

    Well, that's simple, feelings. But the historical roots are Rousseau and the belief man is naturally good.

    When Feelings Became Facts

    ...To understand when feelings became the basis of facts, we must be conversant with the work and thought of the patron-saint and godfather of liberalism, Jean-Jacques Rousseau. Rousseau’s ideology contains the subtleties and nuances involved in the process of making a person’s feelings the basis of facts. The most important starting point is Rousseau’s belief in the natural goodness of man. From his assumptions about the natural goodness of man, all his other premises and conclusions emanate. Rousseau declared,

    The fundamental principle of all morality, upon which I have reasoned in all my writings and which I developed with all the clarity of which I am capable is that man is a being who is naturally good, loving justice and order; that there is no original perversity in the human heart, and the first movements of nature are always good.[1]

    The natural goodness of man is Rousseau’s single most important contribution to the ideology of liberalism. Rousseau, like the liberals who follow in the footsteps of his ideology, believed that human beings are naturally good, pure, and benevolent, but society corrupts us. He argued “that man is naturally good, and that is solely by these institutions that men become wicked.”[2] The evils of the world come not from within, but are introduced from without via society. To create a better world, we must fix society.

    Rousseau’s fame came from his wildly successful novel, Julie, or the New Heloise (1761). The interesting element about this text is that a person who reads it today cannot understand its cultural significance without the scholarly commentary on it. It is extremely tame by contemporary standards. As the philosopher Ernst Cassirer said, “Today, the Nouvelle Heloise as a whole is remote from us; we cannot feel the immediate impact of the force with which it moved and shook Rousseau’s century.”[3] With this novel, Rousseau replaced the concepts of restraint and rationalism with the idea of feelings and emotions as the prime motivators of human conduct.[4] As Cassirer said of Julie,

    Feeling is now raised far above passive ‘impression’ and mere perception…. It no longer appears as a special faculty of the self but rather as its proper source—as the original power of the self, from which all other power grow.[5]

    Rousseau believed that his feelings were the source of morality. He lauded his emotions as legitimate and just moral foundations. Rousseau “identifies the principle of moral good with positive human feelings.”[6] If it feels good, then it is good, so one should do it.

    The remainder of the article compares with Edmund Burke's tragic view of man.
    Tradition is not the worship of ashes, but the preservation of fire. ― Gustav Mahler

  2. The Following 2 Users Say Thank You to Chris For This Useful Post:

    Captdon (07-22-2018),Tahuyaman (07-24-2018)

  3. #2
    Points: 5,943, Level: 18
    Level completed: 33%, Points required for next Level: 407
    Overall activity: 0.0%
    Achievements:
    10000 Experience PointsVeteran
    Mechanic's Avatar Senior Member
    Karma
    24412
    Join Date
    Mar 2017
    Location
    San Francisco Bay Area
    Posts
    416
    Points
    5,943
    Level
    18
    Thanks Given
    491
    Thanked 99x in 75 Posts
    Mentioned
    1 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)
    Seems to be more like conservative morality. What little they have.

  4. #3
    Points: 668,262, Level: 100
    Level completed: 0%, Points required for next Level: 0
    Overall activity: 99.8%
    Achievements:
    SocialRecommendation Second ClassYour first GroupOverdrive50000 Experience PointsTagger First ClassVeteran
    Awards:
    Discussion Ender
    Chris's Avatar Senior Member
    Karma
    433960
    Join Date
    Feb 2012
    Posts
    198,207
    Points
    668,262
    Level
    100
    Thanks Given
    32,237
    Thanked 81,549x in 55,058 Posts
    Mentioned
    2014 Post(s)
    Tagged
    2 Thread(s)
    Quote Originally Posted by Mechanic View Post
    Seems to be more like conservative morality. What little they have.
    Conservates take a tragic view following Burke.

    "In the tragic vision, individual sufferings and social evils are inherent in the innate deficiencies of all human beings, whether these deficiencies are in knowledge, wisdom, morality, or courage. Moreover, the available resources are always inadequate to fulfill all the desires of all the people. Thus there are no “solutions” in the tragic vision, but only trade-offs that still leave many unfulfilled and much unhappiness in the world."

    --Thomas Sowell
    Last edited by Chris; 07-21-2018 at 04:54 PM.
    Tradition is not the worship of ashes, but the preservation of fire. ― Gustav Mahler

  5. The Following 2 Users Say Thank You to Chris For This Useful Post:

    Mister D (07-21-2018),Tahuyaman (07-24-2018)

  6. #4
    Points: 139,062, Level: 89
    Level completed: 89%, Points required for next Level: 388
    Overall activity: 43.0%
    Achievements:
    Tagger First ClassSocial50000 Experience PointsVeteran
    stjames1_53's Avatar Senior Member
    Karma
    58456
    Join Date
    Apr 2016
    Posts
    50,865
    Points
    139,062
    Level
    89
    Thanks Given
    105,039
    Thanked 29,477x in 20,424 Posts
    Mentioned
    175 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)
    Quote Originally Posted by Mechanic View Post
    Seems to be more like conservative morality. What little they have.
    this from a guy who thinks feces on his sidewalk is a good thing................meh
    For waltky: http://quakes.globalincidentmap.com/
    "The Nation that makes a great distinction between its scholars and its warriors will have its thinking done by cowards and its fighting done by fools."
    - Thucydides

    "Democracy is two wolves and a lamb voting on what to have for lunch. Liberty is a well-armed lamb contesting the vote" B. Franklin
    Igitur qui desiderat pacem, praeparet bellum

  7. The Following User Says Thank You to stjames1_53 For This Useful Post:

    Captdon (07-22-2018)

  8. #5
    Points: 18,315, Level: 32
    Level completed: 79%, Points required for next Level: 235
    Overall activity: 0%
    Achievements:
    Veteran25000 Experience Points
    Boris The Animal's Avatar Senior Member
    Karma
    20184
    Join Date
    Feb 2013
    Location
    West End Of The Erie Canal
    Posts
    3,129
    Points
    18,315
    Level
    32
    Thanks Given
    455
    Thanked 1,312x in 898 Posts
    Mentioned
    28 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)
    Burke's view is more in line with what the Bible accurately portrays mankind as-sinful, unregenerate, depraved, wicked. Anyone who thinks mankind is good is delusional at best.
    IT'S JUST BORIS!





  9. The Following 2 Users Say Thank You to Boris The Animal For This Useful Post:

    Mechanic (07-21-2018),stjames1_53 (07-21-2018)

  10. #6
    Points: 139,062, Level: 89
    Level completed: 89%, Points required for next Level: 388
    Overall activity: 43.0%
    Achievements:
    Tagger First ClassSocial50000 Experience PointsVeteran
    stjames1_53's Avatar Senior Member
    Karma
    58456
    Join Date
    Apr 2016
    Posts
    50,865
    Points
    139,062
    Level
    89
    Thanks Given
    105,039
    Thanked 29,477x in 20,424 Posts
    Mentioned
    175 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)
    Quote Originally Posted by Boris The Animal View Post
    Burke's view is more in line with what the Bible accurately portrays mankind as-sinful, unregenerate, depraved, wicked. Anyone who thinks mankind is good is delusional at best.
    some of have instances where they arise from the animal kingdom and act like Men.
    it is interesting to note that heroes are born of the moment, not born that way........
    For waltky: http://quakes.globalincidentmap.com/
    "The Nation that makes a great distinction between its scholars and its warriors will have its thinking done by cowards and its fighting done by fools."
    - Thucydides

    "Democracy is two wolves and a lamb voting on what to have for lunch. Liberty is a well-armed lamb contesting the vote" B. Franklin
    Igitur qui desiderat pacem, praeparet bellum

  11. #7
    Points: 43,849, Level: 51
    Level completed: 18%, Points required for next Level: 1,401
    Overall activity: 13.0%
    Achievements:
    Veteran25000 Experience Points
    Hoosier8's Avatar Senior Member
    Karma
    10229
    Join Date
    May 2012
    Posts
    13,730
    Points
    43,849
    Level
    51
    Thanks Given
    1,421
    Thanked 10,220x in 6,442 Posts
    Mentioned
    65 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)
    Liberal or Neo-liberal morality?

    Todays liberals destroy all past moral standards so I am not sure what kind of morality that is.

  12. The Following User Says Thank You to Hoosier8 For This Useful Post:

    stjames1_53 (07-21-2018)

  13. #8
    Points: 139,062, Level: 89
    Level completed: 89%, Points required for next Level: 388
    Overall activity: 43.0%
    Achievements:
    Tagger First ClassSocial50000 Experience PointsVeteran
    stjames1_53's Avatar Senior Member
    Karma
    58456
    Join Date
    Apr 2016
    Posts
    50,865
    Points
    139,062
    Level
    89
    Thanks Given
    105,039
    Thanked 29,477x in 20,424 Posts
    Mentioned
    175 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)
    Quote Originally Posted by Hoosier8 View Post
    Liberal or Neo-liberal morality?

    Todays liberals destroy all past moral standards so I am not sure what kind of morality that is.
    .....it shifts as fast as their emotions. One day it's duplicity for ignorance, the next is moral outrage against one of their own, or pat a sorry loser on the back and tell them they've actually won (not)..............Hell. there's times you cannot even agree with them, they've changed their mind, again.........
    For waltky: http://quakes.globalincidentmap.com/
    "The Nation that makes a great distinction between its scholars and its warriors will have its thinking done by cowards and its fighting done by fools."
    - Thucydides

    "Democracy is two wolves and a lamb voting on what to have for lunch. Liberty is a well-armed lamb contesting the vote" B. Franklin
    Igitur qui desiderat pacem, praeparet bellum

  14. #9
    Points: 5,943, Level: 18
    Level completed: 33%, Points required for next Level: 407
    Overall activity: 0.0%
    Achievements:
    10000 Experience PointsVeteran
    Mechanic's Avatar Senior Member
    Karma
    24412
    Join Date
    Mar 2017
    Location
    San Francisco Bay Area
    Posts
    416
    Points
    5,943
    Level
    18
    Thanks Given
    491
    Thanked 99x in 75 Posts
    Mentioned
    1 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)
    Morality is generally based in the desire of the society to be safe and have no problems. Unfortunately being able to pick and chose who is going to be ruled by the society has much to do with the morality of that society.

  15. #10
    Points: 5,943, Level: 18
    Level completed: 33%, Points required for next Level: 407
    Overall activity: 0.0%
    Achievements:
    10000 Experience PointsVeteran
    Mechanic's Avatar Senior Member
    Karma
    24412
    Join Date
    Mar 2017
    Location
    San Francisco Bay Area
    Posts
    416
    Points
    5,943
    Level
    18
    Thanks Given
    491
    Thanked 99x in 75 Posts
    Mentioned
    1 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)
    Quote Originally Posted by stjames1_53 View Post
    this from a guy who thinks feces on his sidewalk is a good thing................meh
    You bet it's a good thing as it keeps people like you away and makes the city safe for regular humans.

+ Reply to Thread

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts