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Thread: Bottom 40% Have Negative Net Income

  1. #21
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    Quote Originally Posted by DGUtley View Post
    Yes, it's gotten very expensive to live. Just day to day expenses.

    Credit card debt is going to implode soon, I think. I have come to think that debt, generally, is a function of priority rather than income. I have a brother that doesn't have two nickels to rub together. He and his wife make good incomes but have given their kids everything, monster vacations, all the toys, etc. He's filed for bankruptcy three times. Mrs. U and I are anti-debt hawks. I loathe personal debt. We would go without and our kids went without all that stuff when they were young. My uncle that never made 1/5 of what I make was anti-debt also. He died happy and content -- debt free.

    I acknowledge that there's exceptions to every rule.
    You don't know how lucky you are.
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    Quote Originally Posted by The Xl View Post
    Ever since we went off the gold standard, the poor and working classes have had their wealth stolen via runaway inflation. Fractional Reserve Banking is theft.
    This is the very issue that should be talked about: fractional reserve banking. With nothing to back it up except more taxation, is this not what the first Founders of the American economy hoped to stay away from? A private reserve bank owns its shares of stockholder policies inside of what realm? Worldwide it goes, setting its eyes on the next newest ex-pan/pull/sions!

    Money is 'created' upon the granting of a loan, and as the loan is repaid, that money is eliminated from the economy:

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?time_c...&v=BB4BKLvH3l8

    What the German National Socialists wanted was an end to this fake, currency system stealing the realistic economy.

    Worldwide everyone just about seems to want the American way of life to have more than they can afford to spend! So, where is the money to be made? The Weimar Republic only partially collapsed, so when the Red Octopus defeated Adolf Hitler and the German people, because democracy was bitter, as they also said, if Hitler had won, they just cannot hardly imagine.
    "The Gospel of the Holy Twelve": http://www.essene.com/NazareneGospel/index.html

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    All-vegetarian, all-vegan farms, via the 5th Amendment: Genesis 1, Leviticus 24:18- 21, Psalm 50, Isaiah 1, Isaiah 66:3, 17.

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    Chris's Avatar Senior Member
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    Study Shows That Extreme Poverty Statistics Have Been Overestimated, Especially Among Families With Children

    New research published by the National Bureau of Economic Research (NBER) shows that more than 90 percent of people who had previously been classified as living in extreme poverty were actually misclassified. The number of people deemed to be living in extreme poverty was significantly inflated due to a combination of misreporting on surveys as well as a lack of accurate administrative data.

    Now, new data "allows us to re-examine rates of extreme poverty," which NBER defines as "living on less than $2/person/day." It turns out the actual percentage of U.S. households living in extreme poverty is 0.24 percent.

    ...The authors certainly don't deny that extreme poverty is still an issue, and they point out that their survey data "excludes homeless individuals and institutionalized populations (such as those living in nursing care facilities and prisons)." But their research shows that the number of people in extreme poverty is less of a concern than had been previously believed.

    "In the end, our best estimate of the extreme poverty rate is 0.24% among households and 0.11% among individuals," state the paper authors, adding that they "suspect the true extreme poverty rate is lower, given the evidence of survey underreporting for many income sources."

    The composition of extremely poor households also differs from common understandings of it: "Among the 285,000 households left in extreme poverty, 90% are made up of single individuals. Households with multiple childless individuals make up the other 10% of the extreme poor. Strikingly, after implementing all adjustments, [none of the SIPP surveyed] households with children have incomes below $2/person/day."...
    Edmund Burke: "In vain you tell me that Artificial Government is good, but that I fall out only with the Abuse. The Thing! the Thing itself is the Abuse!"

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    Quote Originally Posted by DGUtley View Post
    Yes, it's gotten very expensive to live. Just day to day expenses.

    Credit card debt is going to implode soon, I think. I have come to think that debt, generally, is a function of priority rather than income. I have a brother that doesn't have two nickels to rub together. He and his wife make good incomes but have given their kids everything, monster vacations, all the toys, etc. He's filed for bankruptcy three times. Mrs. U and I are anti-debt hawks. I loathe personal debt. We would go without and our kids went without all that stuff when they were young. My uncle that never made 1/5 of what I make was anti-debt also. He died happy and content -- debt free.

    I acknowledge that there's exceptions to every rule.
    There is such a thing as good debt. If you can borrow at say 6% and earn 9% , bingo. In addition if you have a use for your capital on say an appreciable asset for 50k that is a better use than paying cash for a 50k toy etc than borrow the money and put the original money to work. When I was in financial planning I do not recall a single instance where there was not pockets of underutilized capital. In the world of finance yoy do all you can " OPM". If you dont you are basically a financial fool. Sure it feels good to Pa Kettle to tighten his overalls and say " dad nabbit pay cash fir everything. Shoot ma some of these things are only depreciating at a rate of 20% annum. Others are well you know , worthless. But by shakees you fat old woman I dont owe a dime.
    " you mean you lack the ability to understand the numbers , utilization of capital etc so that's the path you chose as opposed to working something simple as the Rule of 72 ? Further proof some people are too stupid to have money anyway.
    knock knock , its k-notts. Open up Cotton. Ok, I love animals, I miss dead grandma, I cried when I saw a dog hit by a car. Have I opened up enough for you K-notts? It makes me uncomfy..

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    Quote Originally Posted by The Xl View Post
    Ever since we went off the gold standard, the poor and working classes have had their wealth stolen via runaway inflation. Fractional Reserve Banking is theft.
    Inflation hasn't been an issue for many years. Fractional reserve banking is necessary. It allows people of modest incomes the ability to get a loan and buy their own home.

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    Quote Originally Posted by IMPress Polly View Post
    Yeah, it figures that the natural reaction here would be for a bunch of rich people to lecture poorer people for being poorer than they are.



    Did you even bother to click on the link? I have to ask because the main point contained therein is that the poorer 40% of the population is losing money on balance after you account for increases in the cost of living.



    So I guess then no one should get a college education, right? Or no one should ever take out a loan to pay bills or pay for necessities with a credit card when they have no other means, right? Who needs heating in freezing temperatures when you can have a more balanced budget, right?

    Simplistic, condescending suggestions like the above are unhelpful because they are much easier said than done and often cannot be done in my experience.



    In response to the last recession, they did! It was called personal savings, which peaked back in 2012. The problem here is that, since that time, the cost of living has risen so much that working people writ large have been forced to exhaust most of that buffer.
    I think the other problem is that people were encouraged to spend money to help end the recession, rather than save money. The recession ended but not the spending. The entire system conspires to discourage saving because saving is bad for the financial industry.
    "The difference between what we do and what we are capable of doing would suffice to solve most of the world’s problems.”
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    This isn't a political issue. No President can stop people from spending more than they earn. What do these people think is going to happen?
    Liberals are a clear and present danger to our freedom and our society and our morals.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Tahuyaman View Post
    Inflation hasn't been an issue for many years. Fractional reserve banking is necessary. It allows people of modest incomes the ability to get a loan and buy their own home.
    Inflation pretty much died of by 1990.
    Liberals are a clear and present danger to our freedom and our society and our morals.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Captdon View Post
    This isn't a political issue. No President can stop people from spending more than they earn. What do these people think is going to happen?
    Far too many people are ridiculously suggestible, particularly when it comes to doing something they want to do rather than something they don't want to do. If they are told that spending makes them more patriotic, they will spend without any guilt. Don't forget they have been raised to spend, not save, so saving is unfamiliar and uncomfortable. I recently read something to the effect that millennials are really falling behind when it comes to savings/investments. Part of that is the uncertainty of employment and the high cost of living, student loans etc., but I also think that there are some who do live beyond their means. I see them every day buying their lattes and muffin or other pastry in the morning and then also buying their lunches. They have to be spending $20 a day before dinner. I feel guilty if I spend $10 and I can afford it, but I think it's a waste. The travel industry would be pretty decimated if the younger crowd gave up their vacations even if they are borrowing from Peter to pay Paul.

    We have a very large lunch room at work with multiple microwaves and "toaster ovens". The people you see in there are either middle aged and older or they are frugal immigrants of all ages. If you see the younger domestic crowd, they are bringing in their $10 salads.
    "The difference between what we do and what we are capable of doing would suffice to solve most of the world’s problems.”
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tahuyaman View Post
    Inflation hasn't been an issue for many years. Fractional reserve banking is necessary. It allows people of modest incomes the ability to get a loan and buy their own home.
    Yes, without fractional reserve banking most people would be called renters.
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