PDA

View Full Version : Garden Help



donttread
06-26-2020, 08:36 PM
I am currently winning the garden battle with the gopher, the chipmonks ( yes chipmonks) , powery mildew, and rust. I've seen very few slugs and snails.
But..., there is always a but with gardening, something that I cannot find is eating my cabbage. Sometimes the end of leaves but usually holes in the middle. Whatever it is , it is never present when I look and it is also chewing the shit out a form of wild plaintain that is a persistent weed here.
Any ideas what it might be?

Dr. Who
06-26-2020, 10:52 PM
I am currently winning the garden battle with the gopher, the chipmonks ( yes chipmonks) , powery mildew, and rust. I've seen very few slugs and snails.
But..., there is always a but with gardening, something that I cannot find is eating my cabbage. Sometimes the end of leaves but usually holes in the middle. Whatever it is , it is never present when I look and it is also chewing the shit out a form of wild plaintain that is a persistent weed here.
Any ideas what it might be?
Slugs - they love cabbage and all cruciferous vegetables.

donttread
06-27-2020, 09:09 AM
Slugs - they love cabbage and all cruciferous vegetables.


OK Doc, I have certainly had issues with them in the past so I will take a closer look. I have wondered if whatever was feeding on the leaves did so at night.
Thank you.

jigglepete
06-27-2020, 10:02 AM
I am currently winning the garden battle with the gopher, the chipmonks ( yes chipmonks) , powery mildew, and rust. I've seen very few slugs and snails.
But..., there is always a but with gardening, something that I cannot find is eating my cabbage. Sometimes the end of leaves but usually holes in the middle. Whatever it is , it is never present when I look and it is also chewing the $#@! out a form of wild plaintain that is a persistent weed here.
Any ideas what it might be?

I does sound like slug or snail (shelled slugs) damage. Could you post a picture of the damaged leaves? Also look for slime trails, a dead givaway...

jigglepete
06-27-2020, 10:09 AM
BTW if it is slugs, use diatomaceous earth and make sure it's food grade (obviously). And if it's not slugs, it might be caterpillars, or even earwigs...d.e. will protect against all of them, but a picture says a thousand words...

donttread
06-27-2020, 07:04 PM
I does sound like slug or snail (shelled slugs) damage. Could you post a picture of the damaged leaves? Also look for slime trails, a dead givaway...


Thanks. I'm not much of a picture poster but I did go out and found what may be slime trails on some of the plants. The thing is that I have more slugs most years than I do this year and I can't find any . I've killed maybe 5 slugs/snails all year when sometimes it's 5 or more times that number. So I will treat for slugs along with powery mildew, rust, and the gopher that got in the garden again today because I forgot to close the gate and went golfing. The golf was a disappointment too. LOL

John Galt
06-27-2020, 07:50 PM
Nope...it might not be slugs. You notice those little white moths that flutter around your plants? They're cabbage moths. They lay eggs on the leaves. The eggs look like a pile of green insect feces. Said eggs hatch into cabbage loopers. Little green caterpillars that blend perfectly with the vegetation. They get fat and juicy if they live long enough. Look closely for green caterpillars. They can destroy your crop in a matter of days, and they love all brassicas.

I use BT (bacillus thuringiensis) powder...commonly known as BT. It comes in spray, but brassica leaves tend to be rubbery and waterproof. BT harms nothing but caterpillars of any type. It paralyzes the gut and they starve. It's rated 0 as an organic pesticide, which means you can use it on the day you harvest


https://www.google.com/search?q=cabbage+looper+damage&sxsrf=ALeKk03XhSJypdqf91YlTDA0wqTszG3ThA:159330549 5231&tbm=isch&source=iu&ictx=1&fir=EWzaBl4ZVLbAxM%2C_NHKku7eCxbSiM%2C_&vet=1&usg=AI4_-kQPjVB3mStmaVBhZh7Ui49qNqW1-g&sa=X&ved=2ahUKEwir577ApaPqAhVJhOAKHSYLDJQQ_h0wAHoECAoQB A&biw=1229&bih=578#imgrc=EWzaBl4ZVLbAxM

John Galt
06-27-2020, 07:55 PM
BTW if it is slugs, use diatomaceous earth and make sure it's food grade (obviously). And if it's not slugs, it might be caterpillars, or even earwigs...d.e. will protect against all of them, but a picture says a thousand words...
I've used a variety of things for slugs, but I found this many years ago. Also organic, and it works just like the BT. The slugs eat it, and it paralyzes the gut. Use it early in the season before you see slugs. Kill the first generation, and your summer is much better.


Iron phosphate, and slug attractant.

https://www.amazon.com/Garden-Safe-4536-Snail-HG-4536/dp/B001ACRZFA/ref=asc_df_B001ACRZFA/?tag=hyprod-20&linkCode=df0&hvadid=167137474498&hvpos=&hvnetw=g&hvrand=6241274279032691839&hvpone=&hvptwo=&hvqmt=&hvdev=c&hvdvcmdl=&hvlocint=&hvlocphy=9004887&hvtargid=pla-308609005109&psc=1

donttread
06-28-2020, 05:01 PM
Nope...it might not be slugs. You notice those little white moths that flutter around your plants? They're cabbage moths. They lay eggs on the leaves. The eggs look like a pile of green insect feces. Said eggs hatch into cabbage loopers. Little green caterpillars that blend perfectly with the vegetation. They get fat and juicy if they live long enough. Look closely for green caterpillars. They can destroy your crop in a matter of days, and they love all brassicas.

I use BT (bacillus thuringiensis) powder...commonly known as BT. It comes in spray, but brassica leaves tend to be rubbery and waterproof. BT harms nothing but caterpillars of any type. It paralyzes the gut and they starve. It's rated 0 as an organic pesticide, which means you can use it on the day you harvest


https://www.google.com/search?q=cabbage+looper+damage&sxsrf=ALeKk03XhSJypdqf91YlTDA0wqTszG3ThA:159330549 5231&tbm=isch&source=iu&ictx=1&fir=EWzaBl4ZVLbAxM%2C_NHKku7eCxbSiM%2C_&vet=1&usg=AI4_-kQPjVB3mStmaVBhZh7Ui49qNqW1-g&sa=X&ved=2ahUKEwir577ApaPqAhVJhOAKHSYLDJQQ_h0wAHoECAoQB A&biw=1229&bih=578#imgrc=EWzaBl4ZVLbAxM


Thanks I will look into that.

donttread
06-28-2020, 05:10 PM
I think that I may have found my culprit. It just might be ants! I didn't know that ants ate vegitables but they are the only thing I can catch on or near the plants. Something was eating a squash flower and I found ants on it. When I moved a plant ants exploded out of the new site. So I looked it up and yup they could be the issue.
However the Diatomaceous earth that Jigglepete recomended would work on the ants as well as slugs so I ordered some. In the meantime the article said that ants dislike strong smells ( I'm guessing is interfers with theie communication scents. ) So I picked some mint leaves and sprinkkle some cinnimon. Defending my garden is becoming a full time job!

John Galt
06-28-2020, 05:20 PM
I think that I may have found my culprit. It just might be ants! I didn't know that ants ate vegitables but they are the only thing I can catch on or near the plants. Something was eating a squash flower and I found ants on it. When I moved a plant ants exploded out of the new site. So I looked it up and yup they could be the issue.
However the Diatomaceous earth that Jigglepete recomended would work on the ants as well as slugs so I ordered some. In the meantime the article said that ants dislike strong smells ( I'm guessing is interfers with theie communication scents. ) So I picked some mint leaves and sprinkkle some cinnimon. Defending my garden is becoming a full time job!

Did you check the pictures I linked? Does that look like the damage? Ants like sweets. They typically eat fruit. Strawberries in particular. They do appear en masse on plants that have aphids. They have a symbiotic relationship. The ants protect the aphids, and the aphids secret a sugary substance that the ants harvest.

You might have aphids, but they wouldn't do the damage that you mentioned. If you think ants are your problem, a product named Terro works like magic. Very inexpensive. It's boric acid in corn syrup. They take it home, and it destroys the entire nest within days. Not gonna say that it 'can't' be ants on your cabbage, I've just never seen it. I grow broccoli, not cabbage. Stranger things can happen.


You didn't find green caterpillars?




Terro

https://www.walmart.com/ip/TERRO-Liquid-Ant-Baits-6-Pack/17165156?wmlspartner=wlpa&selectedSellerId=0&adid=22222222227019300298&wl0=&wl1=g&wl2=c&wl3=42529881872&wl4=aud-430887228898:pla-81187379192&wl5=9004887&wl6=&wl7=&wl8=&wl9=pla&wl10=8175035&wl11=online&wl12=17165156&veh=sem&gclid=CjwKCAjw_-D3BRBIEiwAjVMy7A-Rw7ki_neZA0iV1jGmn6SoCcf4qh2HVSvIa1Dxd2i36LU0zEEoX RoChRcQAvD_BwE

donttread
07-03-2020, 10:11 PM
BTW if it is slugs, use diatomaceous earth and make sure it's food grade (obviously). And if it's not slugs, it might be caterpillars, or even earwigs...d.e. will protect against all of them, but a picture says a thousand words...


I ordered some of that product and hope to apply it tomorrow.

donttread
07-03-2020, 10:14 PM
Nope...it might not be slugs. You notice those little white moths that flutter around your plants? They're cabbage moths. They lay eggs on the leaves. The eggs look like a pile of green insect feces. Said eggs hatch into cabbage loopers. Little green caterpillars that blend perfectly with the vegetation. They get fat and juicy if they live long enough. Look closely for green caterpillars. They can destroy your crop in a matter of days, and they love all brassicas.

I use BT (bacillus thuringiensis) powder...commonly known as BT. It comes in spray, but brassica leaves tend to be rubbery and waterproof. BT harms nothing but caterpillars of any type. It paralyzes the gut and they starve. It's rated 0 as an organic pesticide, which means you can use it on the day you harvest


https://www.google.com/search?q=cabbage+looper+damage&sxsrf=ALeKk03XhSJypdqf91YlTDA0wqTszG3ThA:159330549 5231&tbm=isch&source=iu&ictx=1&fir=EWzaBl4ZVLbAxM%2C_NHKku7eCxbSiM%2C_&vet=1&usg=AI4_-kQPjVB3mStmaVBhZh7Ui49qNqW1-g&sa=X&ved=2ahUKEwir577ApaPqAhVJhOAKHSYLDJQQ_h0wAHoECAoQB A&biw=1229&bih=578#imgrc=EWzaBl4ZVLbAxM


That looks like what is happening. I don't know why I can never find the pesky critters though. I'm treating for most everything.

Dr. Who
07-03-2020, 11:06 PM
Here's a list of all the cabbage eaters: https://entomology.ca.uky.edu/ef300

Dr. Who
07-03-2020, 11:12 PM
You might also consider adding some toad houses (https://www.gardeningknowhow.com/special/children/garden-toad-house.htm) to your garden. Toads eat slugs and bugs but don't eat your plants.
https://www.gardeningknowhow.com/plant-problems/pests/insects/kill-garden-slugs.htm

donttread
07-04-2020, 10:44 AM
You might also consider adding some toad houses (https://www.gardeningknowhow.com/special/children/garden-toad-house.htm) to your garden. Toads eat slugs and bugs but don't eat your plants.
https://www.gardeningknowhow.com/plant-problems/pests/insects/kill-garden-slugs.htm


Maybe, although it's a small garden. 165 square feet plus a few buckets. Two years ago I produced more food out of that space then I ever would have believed possible. Not peppers and carrotts but heavy, solid produce like several forms of squash, over a dozen cabbage, tons of broc and over 1,000 tomates although most were cherry or grape. A great number of those never made it to the house! A bunch of eggplants as well and other produce.

BUT over planting has it's down side, that's when the pest convention went of steroids! A hungry gopher, chipmonks tearing the garden up ( I've dispached 18 so far this year alone).Powdery Mildew , Rust, slugs, and who knows what else. So can you tell me what else please? ( Bad puns are kind of my thing) LOL.

I thank you all for the suggestions I spread som D. Earth this morning.

Cotton1
07-04-2020, 10:50 AM
You might also consider adding some toad houses (https://www.gardeningknowhow.com/special/children/garden-toad-house.htm) to your garden. Toads eat slugs and bugs but don't eat your plants.
https://www.gardeningknowhow.com/plant-problems/pests/insects/kill-garden-slugs.htm

You mean frogs? If I had a garden and saw a frog looking at me from behind a tomato plant I'd run !

Dr. Who
07-04-2020, 11:04 AM
Maybe, although it's a small garden. 165 square feet plus a few buckets. Two years ago I produced more food out of that space then I ever would have believed possible. Not peppers and carrotts but heavy, solid produce like several forms of squash, over a dozen cabbage, tons of broc and over 1,000 tomates although most were cherry or grape. A great number of those never made it to the house! A bunch of eggplants as well and other produce.

BUT over planting has it's down side, that's when the pest convention went of steroids! A hungry gopher, chipmonks tearing the garden up ( I've dispached 18 so far this year alone).Powdery Mildew , Rust, slugs, and who knows what else. So can you tell me what else please? ( Bad puns are kind of my thing) LOL.

I thank you all for the suggestions I spread som D. Earth this morning.

As you can see in the link below, a toad house doesn't have to be very large. In fact, if you have an old smaller clay pot (even one that is damaged), you can just lay it on its side and sink that side into the ground. It just provides protection for the toad from the sun. The toads will come out at night and eat all your pests. If you are growing squash, hiding the toad house under the large squash leaves would be ideal. You should also keep a little dish of water nearby, also sunk into the ground.

On the other hand, you could get a duck - they also like to eat what eats your garden, but they are higher maintenance than toads.

https://www.bing.com/images/search?q=toad+house&id=A74AF6DD4DF292DF92838BF670C5934E3D4AA7F7&form=IQFRBA&first=1&scenario=ImageBasicHover

Dr. Who
07-04-2020, 11:10 AM
You mean frogs? If I had a garden and saw a frog looking at me from behind a tomato plant I'd run !
No, toads. Frogs like a more watery environment (except for tree frogs) whereas toads live on dry land. They are totally harmless - they don't even have teeth. They just swallow their food whole.

Peter1469
07-04-2020, 11:13 AM
As you can see in the link below, a toad house doesn't have to be very large. In fact, if you have an old smaller clay pot (even one that is damaged), you can just lay it on its side and sink that side into the ground. It just provides protection for the toad from the sun. The toads will come out at night and eat all your pests. If you are growing squash, hiding the toad house under the large squash leaves would be ideal. You should also keep a little dish of water nearby, also sunk into the ground.

On the other hand, you could get a duck - they also like to eat what eats your garden, but they are higher maintenance than toads.

https://www.bing.com/images/search?q=toad+house&id=A74AF6DD4DF292DF92838BF670C5934E3D4AA7F7&form=IQFRBA&first=1&scenario=ImageBasicHover
But you can eat the duck when after you harvest your garden.

Dr. Who
07-04-2020, 11:18 AM
But you can eat the duck when after you harvest your garden.

:jawdrop::shocked::cry20:

donttread
07-05-2020, 05:02 PM
As you can see in the link below, a toad house doesn't have to be very large. In fact, if you have an old smaller clay pot (even one that is damaged), you can just lay it on its side and sink that side into the ground. It just provides protection for the toad from the sun. The toads will come out at night and eat all your pests. If you are growing squash, hiding the toad house under the large squash leaves would be ideal. You should also keep a little dish of water nearby, also sunk into the ground.

On the other hand, you could get a duck - they also like to eat what eats your garden, but they are higher maintenance than toads.

https://www.bing.com/images/search?q=toad+house&id=A74AF6DD4DF292DF92838BF670C5934E3D4AA7F7&form=IQFRBA&first=1&scenario=ImageBasicHover


Damn, it's a real product! Some going for a pretty good price. I thought you meant home made, which is what I would do. Do I have to find my own toads or will they just move in because of the shetar?

Dr. Who
07-05-2020, 05:36 PM
Damn, it's a real product! Some going for a pretty good price. I thought you meant home made, which is what I would do. Do I have to find my own toads or will they just move in because of the shetar?
If they are around, they will be attracted to your toad house. Otherwise, you might have to find a couple or get one of the neighborhood kids to find you some. They won't hang around if you are using pesticides. If you have some old clay pots, they work as well as the store bought but cuter toad houses. You have to make sure you put out that dish of water to attract the toads and you should keep the area under the toad house moist. Toads like to soak themselves in water, which is how they hydrate themselves as they don't actually drink it, so make sure the toad bath isn't too small. Also, since the toad area is one where you will put more water, make sure it's an area where the plants appreciate the extra watering.

donttread
07-08-2020, 09:30 PM
I applied the D Earth carefully so as not to get it on the flowers and so far so good. I also noticed some small brown flying bettles pollination my squash quite nicely.

Ethereal
07-09-2020, 01:35 AM
Okay... it was me. I ate the cabbage. Nibbled it ever-so-gingerly. I didn't want to, but those leaves... so inviting. I cannot promise I'll stop, but I can promise to try. Please find it in your heart to forgive me.

donttread
07-11-2020, 07:54 AM
Okay... it was me. I ate the cabbage. Nibbled it ever-so-gingerly. I didn't want to, but those leaves... so inviting. I cannot promise I'll stop, but I can promise to try. Please find it in your heart to forgive me.


There will be traps in the garden from now on! I forgive but I don't forget!