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Conley
11-30-2011, 09:19 AM
HONG KONG – Faced with an economy that appears to be slowing faster than economists expected even a month ago, the Chinese government on Wednesday evening unexpectedly reversed its year-long move toward tighter monetary policy and took an important step to encourage banks to resume lending.

The central bank said Wednesday that commercial banks would be allowed to keep a slightly lower percentage of their deposits as reserves at the central bank. The change, which will take effect on Monday, means that commercial banks will have more money available to lend, which could help to rekindle economic growth and a slumping real estate market.

Real estate developers, small businesses and other borrowers have been complaining strenuously in recent weeks (http://www.nytimes.com/2011/11/08/business/global/chinas-businesses-find-loans-are-harder-to-get.html) of weakening sales and scarce credit. Prices have dropped up to 28 percent for new apartments in some Chinese cities this autumn (http://www.nytimes.com/2011/11/11/business/global/government-policies-cool-china-real-estate-boom.html), real estate brokers have been laying off thousands of agents as transactions have dried up, and export orders have slumped.

http://www.nytimes.com/2011/12/01/business/global/china-reverses-economic-policy.html

They had a housing bubble burst like we did here. Unlike us, they also have to worry about inflation. It's interesting, if you read the papers it sounds like economies all over the globe are struggling. I'm not sure where things are good right now, but the U.S. is actually faring a lot better than many places - something we should be thankful for.

Mister D
11-30-2011, 10:08 AM
HONG KONG – Faced with an economy that appears to be slowing faster than economists expected even a month ago, the Chinese government on Wednesday evening unexpectedly reversed its year-long move toward tighter monetary policy and took an important step to encourage banks to resume lending.

The central bank said Wednesday that commercial banks would be allowed to keep a slightly lower percentage of their deposits as reserves at the central bank. The change, which will take effect on Monday, means that commercial banks will have more money available to lend, which could help to rekindle economic growth and a slumping real estate market.

Real estate developers, small businesses and other borrowers have been complaining strenuously in recent weeks (http://www.nytimes.com/2011/11/08/business/global/chinas-businesses-find-loans-are-harder-to-get.html) of weakening sales and scarce credit. Prices have dropped up to 28 percent for new apartments in some Chinese cities this autumn (http://www.nytimes.com/2011/11/11/business/global/government-policies-cool-china-real-estate-boom.html), real estate brokers have been laying off thousands of agents as transactions have dried up, and export orders have slumped.

http://www.nytimes.com/2011/12/01/business/global/china-reverses-economic-policy.html

They had a housing bubble burst like we did here. Unlike us, they also have to worry about inflation. It's interesting, if you read the papers it sounds like economies all over the globe are struggling. I'm not sure where things are good right now, but the U.S. is actually faring a lot better than many places - something we should be thankful for.

No surpise there. The world's economies are all tied together for the most part. If a major economy falters it will affect all.

China will have a lot of hurdles in the coming years. I'm not sure why everyone always points to China.

Conley
11-30-2011, 10:57 AM
I suppose that's true. I'd rather be "poor" in the United States than China, that's for sure.

Mister D
11-30-2011, 11:06 AM
No contest and most Chinese are what we would consider poor. I'm not sure how poverty would be in rural China though. That sort of life is a whole different world that is largely unimaginable to me and I don;t mean that in a bad way.

jgreer
11-30-2011, 11:21 AM
How do you think poor people here compare to those in Sweden? Hint: They would rather be in Sweden!

jgreer
11-30-2011, 11:22 AM
Its funny for you guys to compare the USA's social programs to China and give yourself a pat on the back about it. By the way if it weren't for liberals unions and the like our working conditions would be a lot like theres!

Mister D
11-30-2011, 11:28 AM
Its funny for you guys to compare the USA's social programs to China and give yourself a pat on the back about it. By the way if it weren't for liberals unions and the like our working conditions would be a lot like theres!

Who has compared our social prograns to China's?

Mister D
11-30-2011, 11:29 AM
How do you think poor people here compare to those in Sweden? Hint: They would rather be in Sweden!

Who wouldn't want to be a largely homogeneous and predominantly white country? It's the American dream!

jgreer
11-30-2011, 11:42 AM
You are talking about poor people so it makes sense that we would talk about the safety net for them too. The whiteness of Sweden has nothing to do with it.

Mister D
11-30-2011, 11:47 AM
Comparisons between relatively tiny, homogeneous nations and the USA are not very helpful. Keep that in mind. Yes, the homogeneity of Sweden has a lot to do with social bonds (and thus the willingness of Swedes to tolerate a welfare state) as social scientists will tell you.

jgreer
11-30-2011, 11:57 AM
the biggest and real reason swedens poor have it better is because people are willing to have their tax dollars pay for good (food schools etc.) and not bombs and machines of death

sweden is not a welfare state and the color of their skin is not part of it

Mister D
11-30-2011, 12:02 PM
the biggest and real reason swedens poor have it better is because people are willing to have their tax dollars pay for good (food schools etc.) and not bombs and machines of death

sweden is not a welfare state and the color of their skin is not part of it

Sweden is a welfare state.

Yes, Swedes are willing to have their tax dollars pay for less fortunate Swedes. You'll get it eventually. I have faith in you. :wink:

Conley
11-30-2011, 12:07 PM
I wonder how much more the Swedes pay in taxes than we do. When you add up all the taxes in this country (a lot more than just federal income tax) I bet the difference isn't as big as many think. We probably get taxed at rates close to many European countries.

Mister D
11-30-2011, 12:11 PM
I don't know. I'm sure there must be a comparison online somewhere. You also have to factor in what you receive back in services versus what you contribute.

Peter1469
11-30-2011, 07:17 PM
China's economic bubbles are unrelated to the West's. Largely that is.

China is trying to transition from an export economy to a consumer economy. They are as advanced as they can get under the pure export model. And it ain't that great. They have even odds or less in making that transition work.

They also have a massive real estate bubble that is about to pop.

Mister D
11-30-2011, 08:09 PM
They also have a serious demographic problem related to not just aging but aging while they are still relatively poor.

Conley
11-30-2011, 08:24 PM
From what I've read begging is a huge problem over there. There are tons of them and they're elderly...it's very sad.

Mister D
11-30-2011, 08:29 PM
From what I've read begging is a huge problem over there. There are tons of them and they're elderly...it's very sad.

That's why the savings rate is so high in China. There is no safety net and with the one child policy you're kind of screwed. A married couple will have 4 elderly folks to look out for.

Captain Obvious
11-30-2011, 09:59 PM
They also have a serious demographic problem related to not just aging but aging while they are still relatively poor.

Add human rights issues, working conditions, standard of living. Makes you wonder how "propped up" their implied golden age really is.

Mister D
11-30-2011, 10:06 PM
Add human rights issues, working conditions, standard of living. Makes you wonder how "propped up" their implied golden age really is.

True. They will have quite a few hurdles in the coming years. I'm remember you were somewhat skeptical with regard to China. I'm inclined to agree.

waltky
04-15-2016, 11:39 PM
Chinese economy walkin' the tightrope...
:huh:
China's economic tightrope act
Fri, 15 Apr 2016 05:29:10 GMT (22 hours and 58 mins ago)
How will China manage the economic transition it has embarked on, asks Andrew Walker.


Are the storm clouds gathering over the global economy once again - and are they blowing in from the East, more specifically from China? There are certainly worries casting some gloom over the Spring Meetings of the International Monetary Fund and World Bank in Washington this week. China's latest figures show the economy in the first quarter of the year expanding 6.7% from a year earlier. The slowdown continues. But the data do not give us any definitive answers to questions about how China is going to influence the rest of the world.


http://ichef-1.bbci.co.uk/news/320/cpsprodpb/12857/production/_89236857_89236778.jpg

The big issue is how will China manage the economic transition it has embarked on: a shift from a pattern of economic growth based on the rapid expansion of industrial output, exports and investment to one more driven by spending by Chinese consumers and growing service industries. China is also engaged in a shift to growth that is slower than the average 10% per year of the past three decades. That figure is almost universally reckoned to be no longer sustainable. But if the result is anything like the 6.5% minimum that the authorities are targeting for the next five years, it will still be pretty impressive by international standards.

Investment

It is also worth noting the extraordinary role played by investment - by the state and by business. Last year, according to data compiled by the IMF, investment was 43% of national income or GDP. Very few countries can, or would, want to match that. It is a problem because such high rates of investment are bound to involve many specific projects that are not viable, especially in an economy that is slowing down anyway. That in turn would mean losses for the businesses concerned and for the investors and lenders who provide the finance.

The share of investment in GDP has started to decline - it used to be even higher - but it has further to go. That process and the wider slowdown are already making a mark on the rest of the world and will continue to do so. A batch of IMF reports this week issued ahead of the Spring Meetings, on the general economic outlook, financial stability and government finances around the world, all show the impact of the Chinese slowdown. The IMF's World Economic Outlook painted a picture of persistently disappointing performance after the Western financial crisis, a world economy that has failed to gather sufficient momentum to produce a really strong recovery - and China was part of that story.

Risk (http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-36040706)

Tahuyaman
04-15-2016, 11:45 PM
Chinese Economy Slowing Down
the Chinese economy has been in a bad state for months.

waltky
01-20-2017, 05:17 PM
Granny gettin' a good return on her rickshaw stock...
http://www.politicalforum.com/images/smilies/icon_grandma.gif
China's economy grows 6.7% in 2016
Fri, 20 Jan 2017 - The figure meets Beijing's forecasts, but some say growth is slower than the official data suggests.


China's economy grew by 6.7% in 2016, compared with 6.9% a year earlier, according to official data, marking its slowest growth since 1990. The figure is in line with Beijing's growth target of between 6.5% and 7%. But the data comes days after the leader of one Chinese province admitted GDP data was faked for several years. China is a key driver of the global economy and a growth slowdown is a major concern for investors around the world.

'Deception'

Some analysts have taken heart from data showing growth in the last three months of 2016 was at an annual rate of 6.8% - a slightly faster pace than the rest of the year. But many observers have been saying for years that the country's growth was actually much weaker than the official data suggests. And those beliefs gained more support this week, when the governor of Liaoning, Chen Qiufa, said his province had been "involved in a large-scale financial deception" between 2011 and 2014, and that economic data had been doctored. Addressing reporters' questions about the Liaoning admission, the director of the National Bureau of Statistics said on Friday that the national data was "truthful and reliable".


http://ichef-1.bbci.co.uk/news/320/cpsprodpb/13267/production/_91293487_china.yuan.bundle.g.jpg

Ning Jizhe added that "statistics departments on various levels will also be strengthening the law enforcement, supervision, and checks on figures" and "resolutely guarding and preventing" the fabricating of data. China is the world's second-biggest importer of both goods and commercial services, meaning its economic performance has a big knock-on impact around the world. It plays an important role as a buyer of oil and other commodities, and its slowdown has been a factor in the decline in the prices of such goods. Beijing's aim to rebalance the economy towards domestic consumption has led to major challenges for large manufacturing sectors, and there have been layoffs - especially in heavily staffed state-run sectors such as the steel industry.

Can we trust the numbers? By Stephen McDonell, BBC Beijing Correspondent

Plenty of economists think that GDP is a massively flawed form of measuring the health of any economy but in this country it is even worse. There is a significant proportion of China watchers who don't believe the GDP figures are real at all. For example, in 2016, the country's (year on year) GDP was exactly 6.7% for three quarters in a row. While this seems numerically unlikely, I suppose it is possible that this could happen. Without solid, reliable figures this remains a debate with wide-ranging, conflicting views. Mind you, even if at worse China's real GDP is around 4% at present, there are plenty of national governments which wouldn't mind a taste of those numbers.

Trump effect? (http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-38686568)

MisterVeritis
01-20-2017, 06:55 PM
Sweden is a welfare state.

Yes, Swedes are willing to have their tax dollars pay for less fortunate Swedes. You'll get it eventually. I have faith in you. :wink:
Sweden laws become Islamicized. I believe the dream is almost over.