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Libhater
09-19-2013, 09:25 PM
Interesting to me was the fact that 24 out of the 26 Vietnam veterans that shared their traumatic combat episodes with me and the clinicians at our PTSD cohort inside the Veterans Hospital at West Haven, Ct. had been severely abused/traumatized as adolescents by the hands of one or two parents.


Despite the fact that most of the veterans had more severe PTSD symptoms as a result of their abusive childhood then they did from actual combat, every one of them received their 100% total and permanent disability rating as did I as a result of our combat. There were 13 PTSD cohort programs prior to my particular one in 1992 where each one had 26 combat veterans taking classes and a sort of rehabilitating process with group and individual therapies via psychologists and psychiatrists. There were no less than 7 suicides from the 14 programs during that time.


I've been a an in-patient and an out-patient in 6 different Veteran's Hospitals in New England. I understand that these PTSD programs have been eliminated from most if not all of the Veterans Hospitals. I also saw where a good number of the Middle East veterans are coming back displaying PTSD symptoms, but are finding it difficult to get the proper help or are having difficulty opening and or securing a disability claim.


The abuse/trauma I suffered as a child certainly outweighed the trauma I suffered with my role as a combat grunt. I told the Hospital psychiatrist that my combat tour in Vietnam was a like a walk in the park compared to the childhood beatings I received at the hands of my father. I feared more for my life at home then I did during a fire fight with Charlie; probably because I was only 11 years old at home and as a 20 year old in combat I was more able to defend myself.

Chloe
09-19-2013, 09:36 PM
Im sorry you had such a rough childhood. I couldn't imagine those kinds of experiences. If you dont mind me asking do you think that's why you are so kind of confrontational now? Was your dad a liberal?

Dr. Who
09-19-2013, 09:47 PM
Interesting to me was the fact that 24 out of the 26 Vietnam veterans that shared their traumatic combat episodes with me and the clinicians at our PTSD cohort inside the Veterans Hospital at West Haven, Ct. had been severely abused/traumatized as adolescents by the hands of one or two parents.


Despite the fact that most of the veterans had more severe PTSD symptoms as a result of their abusive childhood then they did from actual combat, every one of them received their 100% total and permanent disability rating as did I as a result of our combat. There were 13 PTSD cohort programs prior to my particular one in 1992 where each one had 26 combat veterans taking classes and a sort of rehabilitating process with group and individual therapies via psychologists and psychiatrists. There were no less than 7 suicides from the 14 programs during that time.


I've been a an in-patient and an out-patient in 6 different Veteran's Hospitals in New England. I understand that these PTSD programs have been eliminated from most if not all of the Veterans Hospitals. I also saw where a good number of the Middle East veterans are coming back displaying PTSD symptoms, but are finding it difficult to get the proper help or are having difficulty opening and or securing a disability claim.


The abuse/trauma I suffered as a child certainly outweighed the trauma I suffered with my role as a combat grunt. I told the Hospital psychiatrist that my combat tour in Vietnam was a like a walk in the park compared to the childhood beatings I received at the hands of my father. I feared more for my life at home then I did during a fire fight with Charlie; probably because I was only 11 years old at home and as a 20 year old in combat I was more able to defend myself.
Just attended a seminar today about concussion and how PTSD and other psych issues can mimic the symptoms of brain injury or exacerbate the symptoms. So it is unsurprising that prior history can affect the susceptibility to PTSD. Most people with childhood psychological trauma are more susceptible to any form of second stage or later development of neurological or psychological trauma. One very common secondary effect is anger.

Libhater
09-19-2013, 10:20 PM
Im sorry you had such a rough childhood. I couldn't imagine those kinds of experiences. If you dont mind me asking do you think that's why you are so kind of confrontational now? Was your dad a liberal?

Interesting question. I had at age 11 my individuality and psyche development seriously arrested, so I was left with only two options, and that was to either live life as a peon to be a subservient to those wielding a superior position over me (as had my father and military superiors etc.), or to fight for my dignity, to question any and all authority figures and to utilize all innate strengths to be my own person having my own set of values.


My mother and father are both staunch Conservatives from the old school of hard knocks.

My guess is what you might see in me as being confrontational is just me being secure in my unwavering belief system.

Libhater
09-20-2013, 05:39 AM
Just attended a seminar today about concussion and how PTSD and other psych issues can mimic the symptoms of brain injury or exacerbate the symptoms. So it is unsurprising that prior history can affect the susceptibility to PTSD. Most people with childhood psychological trauma are more susceptible to any form of second stage or later development of neurological or psychological trauma. One very common secondary effect is anger.

I'm far from an expert on second stage development of PTSD, but my hunch tells me that those patients suffering from adult PTSD be it via combat or non combat trauma would be much more susceptible to advanced stages of psychological impairments. Personally, anger wasn't one of my more serious issues; perhaps those VA anger management classes paid off for me in the long run...LOL!

What I did learn about PTSD is that those most affected by its trauma were people who felt helpless and fearful at the time of the incident(s). I can't help but to think that women who were raped at gunpoint or from a man wielding a knife while threatening their life would be the most susceptible to acquiring advanced and or chronic symptomatic stages of PTSD (such as having anger & trust issues) since they were both fearful and helpless at the time.

Cigar
09-20-2013, 06:38 AM
Explains a lot ......................

Enough said ..............

Libhater
09-20-2013, 10:08 AM
Explains a lot ......................

You're right, as in my case it explains why I developed a strong set of Conservative, patriotic and self determining values that put me in good stead when faced with life's challenges. It further enhanced my ability to strive for excellence in all endeavors while teaching others how to do the same while rejecting the lure of a big government leftist-loaded pacifier.

Dr. Who
09-20-2013, 07:07 PM
I'm far from an expert on second stage development of PTSD, but my hunch tells me that those patients suffering from adult PTSD be it via combat or non combat trauma would be much more susceptible to advanced stages of psychological impairments. Personally, anger wasn't one of my more serious issues; perhaps those VA anger management classes paid off for me in the long run...LOL!

What I did learn about PTSD is that those most affected by its trauma were people who felt helpless and fearful at the time of the incident(s). I can't help but to think that women who were raped at gunpoint or from a man wielding a knife while threatening their life would be the most susceptible to acquiring advanced and or chronic symptomatic stages of PTSD (such as having anger & trust issues) since they were both fearful and helpless at the time.
Though not implicitly suggesting that you might have issues secondary to childhood trauma, it is possible that Conservatism provides a method of controlling environment.

Peter1469
09-20-2013, 07:44 PM
There is a link between PTSD and other factors..., many people experience combat (or other traumatic non-combat events) and have no problems, while others do. And it seems to be linked to childhood issues. Plus, the effects are cumulative. You can go through lots of shit with no real problem, and then something breaks the camel's back. And then everything changes.

Dr. Who
09-20-2013, 07:55 PM
There is a link between PTSD and other factors..., many people experience combat (or other traumatic non-combat events) and have no problems, while others do. And it seems to be linked to childhood issues. Plus, the effects are cumulative. You can go through lots of shit with no real problem, and then something breaks the camel's back. And then everything changes.

Indeed. As mentioned before I work in claims. People who have experienced horrific trauma in their childhood, such as direct involvement in wars, the holocaust or the political issues in South America - kidnappings, executions, torture and disappearances seem to have a much reduced ability to cope with adult trauma, whether it be physical or psychological or a combination of both.

Libhater
09-20-2013, 11:06 PM
Though not implicitly suggesting that you might have issues secondary to childhood trauma, it is possible that Conservatism provides a method of controlling environment.

Unlike the global warming kooks who think our carbon footprints are destroying the environment, I have always believed that it was our Conservative GOD (mother nature) who controlled the vicissitudes of the environment.

Dr. Who
09-20-2013, 11:21 PM
Unlike the global warming kooks who think our carbon footprints are destroying the environment, I have always believed that it was our Conservative GOD (mother nature) who controlled the vicissitudes of the environment.I use environment in more of a humanistic sense. Something more personal to your own environment, and how you interact with people. Conservatism does provide more rules with respect to personal behavior, lifestyle and politics. I also agree that the scriptures generally advocate conservatism, however they do not advocate judgment of others. Among other scriptures there is Matthew 7:1-5:
“Judge not, that you be not judged. For with the judgment you pronounce you will be judged, and with the measure you use it will be measured to you. Why do you see the speck that is in your brother's eye, but do not notice the log that is in your own eye? Or how can you say to your brother, ‘Let me take the speck out of your eye,’ when there is the log in your own eye? You hypocrite, first take the log out of your own eye, and then you will see clearly to take the speck out of your brother's eye.

Ravi
09-21-2013, 12:32 AM
If you post on the internet with a screenname that includes the word hater, you don't have a good handle on your PTSD. Do you own guns?

Libhater
09-21-2013, 07:57 AM
I use environment in more of a humanistic sense.

That seems to be your problem right there. Humanity is the quality or state of being human. Leftists in general have this need to find these scapegoat issues like some of the more egregious aspects of our environment (Mother Nature) in order to project a sense of being in tuned with humanity and with what people should do to fix the wrongs according to their own near sighted view. Their is absolutely nothing humanistic about protecting the spotted owl from a so-called endangered environment while at the same time ensuring that thousands of farmers, lumbermen, and other related occupations from the GOD's green forest get eliminated.


Something more personal to your own environment, and how you interact with people. Conservatism does provide more rules with respect to personal behavior, lifestyle and politics. I also agree that the scriptures generally advocate conservatism, however they do not advocate judgment of others. Among other scriptures there is Matthew 7:1-5:
“Judge not, that you be not judged. For with the judgment you pronounce you will be judged, and with the measure you use it will be measured to you. Why do you see the speck that is in your brother's eye, but do not notice the log that is in your own eye? Or how can you say to your brother, ‘Let me take the speck out of your eye,’ when there is the log in your own eye?


First of all I never said that I haven't sinned--being a mortal man and all. Having said that, are you joking about judging others? LMFAO! Look, you're a moderator of a friggin political website for crying out loud. You couldn't find one post here that isn't in itself controversial and or has an element of judgment in it. My guess is that you wouldn't even have this site here if it weren't for people judging others.




You hypocrite, first take the log out of your own eye, and then you will see clearly to take the speck out of your brother's eye.

Oh this is just precious. Carry on if you must!

Ravi
09-21-2013, 08:53 AM
lmao at the word "environment" being so totally misunderstood by LH.

Libhater
09-21-2013, 09:50 AM
lmao at the word "environment" being so totally misunderstood by LH.

Perhaps you could enlighten the forum as to your particular view of our environment and as to how you as a leftist are contributing to its overall significance to yours and or to our lives as humans on GOD's green earth. If you were to tell us that you as a leftist feel more comfortable living in an environment of fear that our coal plants and the farts from cows are spewing forth so much carbon dioxide that you feel the American people should be taxed through the yahzoo to pacify the fears of leftists international....then I say I'll be glad to misunderstand your environment while I keep on living an exciting and happy life in my own manmade environment, minus the taxes of course.

Adelaide
09-21-2013, 03:12 PM
Just attended a seminar today about concussion and how PTSD and other psych issues can mimic the symptoms of brain injury or exacerbate the symptoms. So it is unsurprising that prior history can affect the susceptibility to PTSD. Most people with childhood psychological trauma are more susceptible to any form of second stage or later development of neurological or psychological trauma. One very common secondary effect is anger.

There are a bunch of situations that a person can experience them that will predispose them to to PTSD or related conditions after a stressful/traumatic incident. It's generally agreed upon that anyone with a troubled childhood or who already experiences some kind of anxiety problem will be at a much high risk of developing PTSD. It makes sense. Neurologically, your brain does change when your experience stress or abuse so there is science behind it.

Dr. Who
09-21-2013, 03:22 PM
That seems to be your problem right there. Humanity is the quality or state of being human. Leftists in general have this need to find these scapegoat issues like some of the more egregious aspects of our environment (Mother Nature) in order to project a sense of being in tuned with humanity and with what people should do to fix the wrongs according to their own near sighted view. Their is absolutely nothing humanistic about protecting the spotted owl from a so-called endangered environment while at the same time ensuring that thousands of farmers, lumbermen, and other related occupations from the GOD's green forest get eliminated.




First of all I never said that I haven't sinned--being a mortal man and all. Having said that, are you joking about judging others? LMFAO! Look, you're a moderator of a friggin political website for crying out loud. You couldn't find one post here that isn't in itself controversial and or has an element of judgment in it. My guess is that you wouldn't even have this site here if it weren't for people judging others.





Oh this is just precious. Carry on if you must!

Your last quote is still part of Matthew 7:1-5. Not my words, his.

Peter1469
09-21-2013, 04:43 PM
There are a bunch of situations that a person can experience them that will predispose them to to PTSD or related conditions after a stressful/traumatic incident. It's generally agreed upon that anyone with a troubled childhood or who already experiences some kind of anxiety problem will be at a much high risk of developing PTSD. It makes sense. Neurologically, your brain does change when your experience stress or abuse so there is science behind it.


And it is also a cumulative effect over time. You can have a lot of past trauma and a new event just breaks the camel's back. All of a sudden you are a different person.

Dr. Who
09-21-2013, 04:55 PM
And it is also a cumulative effect over time. You can have a lot of past trauma and a new event just breaks the camel's back. All of a sudden you are a different person.I understand. I saw it in my father, as he got older, and he was diagnosed with macular degeneration. As he began to lose his eyesight, he reacted more and more to small things. Then there was an incident that was completely idiotic, that had nothing to do with anything that he had done, but for which he was accused and was ultimately vindicated and he dwelled on it to the point where we wondered about his sanity. He eventually got over it, but it took almost two years.

Adelaide
09-21-2013, 04:57 PM
Marie_archer has been banned from this thread.

Ethereal
09-26-2013, 11:32 AM
I don't like the military's obsession with raising "awareness" about PTSD in combat vets. Everyone already knows about it - in WWII they called it "shell shock" - nowadays, it's all over the place and it's creating this image of veterans as unstable and potentially dangerous. There ARE some people who have real combat PTSD and they CAN be dangerous and unstable, but those guys are few and far between and it's because it takes some REAL stuff to break someone down like that. The rest of the "PTSD" cases are just guys who want money or who had pre-existing psychological issues that were brought to the surface through the stress of combat. We need to stop peddling this PTSD cottage industry because it's inaccurate and does a disservice to the vast majority of veterans who do not suffer from PTSD.

Ethereal
09-26-2013, 11:38 AM
If you post on the internet with a screenname that includes the word hater, you don't have a good handle on your PTSD.

Are you a medical professional of some sort?


Do you own guns?

Why? Are you planning on reporting him to the federal government? Wouldn't surprise me in the least. Today's Democrats are yesterday's McCarthyists.

Alyosha
09-26-2013, 11:50 AM
Democrats are the new tattle tales. Suddenly, now that Obama is in office, they care about the country and want to keep it together. When Bush won his second term they were all about splitting the country down the middle.

Libhater
09-26-2013, 02:31 PM
I don't like the military's obsession with raising "awareness" about PTSD in combat vets. Everyone already knows about it - in WWII they called it "shell shock" - nowadays, it's all over the place and it's creating this image of veterans as unstable and potentially dangerous. There ARE some people who have real combat PTSD and they CAN be dangerous and unstable, but those guys are few and far between and it's because it takes some REAL stuff to break someone down like that. The rest of the "PTSD" cases are just guys who want money or who had pre-existing psychological issues that were brought to the surface through the stress of combat. We need to stop peddling this PTSD cottage industry because it's inaccurate and does a disservice to the vast majority of veterans who do not suffer from PTSD.

I'm kind of ambivalent with your post here. I do agree with you that the VA has pushed the PTSD illness a bit far, and there are certainly a few phonies who try to get their 100% total and permanent disability status when in truth there is probably nothing wrong with them emotionally and or physically-- in order to suck up the many free bennies including a healthy monthly check.

I did post the fact that the brunt of my PTSD symptoms came as a result of my child abuse, but the fact still remains that those symptoms led the way for my adult (combat) problems with PTSD. You see, in order for a combat veteran to qualify for 100% benefits for PTSD they must be certified unemployable by a team of VA doctors. There are a lot of factors that go into determining if a vet is unemployable, and so if a vet does get that 100% rating--rest assured he cannot perform in any occupation that involves working in a public venue.

There are VA Vocational Rehabilitation programs where a 100% rated combat veteran can actually train to work again under very strict conditions. Most the time a PTSD veteran is asked to perform voluntary work (sort of like pre season exercises/games for a pro sports team) for starters before sending them out into the public to where they may not be able to handle the stress. Some veterans failed with the voc rehab programs once they were sent into public venues where there were Oriental people working who reminded the veteran of his time in combat fighting the slant eyes.

Ethereal
09-26-2013, 04:07 PM
I'm kind of ambivalent with your post here. I do agree with you that the VA has pushed the PTSD illness a bit far, and there are certainly a few phonies who try to get their 100% total and permanent disability status when in truth there is probably nothing wrong with them emotionally and or physically-- in order to suck up the many free bennies including a healthy monthly check.

I did post the fact that the brunt of my PTSD symptoms came as a result of my child abuse, but the fact still remains that those symptoms led the way for my adult (combat) problems with PTSD. You see, in order for a combat veteran to qualify for 100% benefits for PTSD they must be certified unemployable by a team of VA doctors. There are a lot of factors that go into determining if a vet is unemployable, and so if a vet does get that 100% rating--rest assured he cannot perform in any occupation that involves working in a public venue.

There are VA Vocational Rehabilitation programs where a 100% rated combat veteran can actually train to work again under very strict conditions. Most the time a PTSD veteran is asked to perform voluntary work (sort of like pre season exercises/games for a pro sports team) for starters before sending them out into the public to where they may not be able to handle the stress. Some veterans failed with the voc rehab programs once they were sent into public venues where there were Oriental people working who reminded the veteran of his time in combat fighting the slant eyes.

The second you tell an employer you're a veteran, they automatically think "PTSD" or "invisible scars". I want people with PTSD to get help, but the VA and company needs to stop this sappy propaganda campaign and they need to square away the benefits systems. WWII vets with shell shock were just expected to be tough and deal with it and nowadays if you have a little extra anxiety from combat you get money from Uncle Sugar. What the heck is that crap? I could have easily gotten PTSD benefits even though I wasn't the least bit traumatized. All you have to do is say, "I think I got PTSD from a mortar blowing up fifty meters away" and they'll cut you a check. That ain't right.

Libhater
09-26-2013, 07:42 PM
I could have easily gotten PTSD benefits even though I wasn't the least bit traumatized. All you have to do is say, "I think I got PTSD from a mortar blowing up fifty meters away" and they'll cut you a check. That ain't right.

Its not as easy as you suggest for veterans to secure a PTSD claim (especially for 100%). I don't know the process for today's veterans in their attempt to seek benefits for PTSD, but it was quite an ordeal for Vietnam veterans, I assure you. For me, I had to check into a VA psyche ward to engage in a 4-month in-patient program designed to get to the underlying factors of this PTSD monster. We were bussed over to Yale Medical center where we undertook various tests to study our symptoms. We were subjected to yohimbine(sp) tests or spinal taps, psyche testing and various forms of individual and group therapies etc. After the 4-month PTSD cohort we had outpatient therapies as well. I didn't receive my 100% for PTSD until a full five years after checking myself into the hospital. Any guys who gave dirty(weed) urine samples or alcohol were immediately thrown out of the program, and were not allowed to pursue any further benefits for PTSD. In short, very few guys could have faked their PTSD symptoms, and those that did fake them were spotted and released from the program.

Codename Section
09-27-2013, 06:41 PM
Its not as easy as you suggest for veterans to secure a PTSD claim (especially for 100%). I don't know the process for today's veterans in their attempt to seek benefits for PTSD, but it was quite an ordeal for Vietnam veterans, I assure you. For me, I had to check into a VA psyche ward to engage in a 4-month in-patient program designed to get to the underlying factors of this PTSD monster. We were bussed over to Yale Medical center where we undertook various tests to study our symptoms. We were subjected to yohimbine(sp) tests or spinal taps, psyche testing and various forms of individual and group therapies etc. After the 4-month PTSD cohort we had outpatient therapies as well. I didn't receive my 100% for PTSD until a full five years after checking myself into the hospital. Any guys who gave dirty(weed) urine samples or alcohol were immediately thrown out of the program, and were not allowed to pursue any further benefits for PTSD. In short, very few guys could have faked their PTSD symptoms, and those that did fake them were spotted and released from the program.

I think you should try again. They're doping us up now. In fact, since about 2008 or 2009 the US Navy began this process through their Safety Center about hyping up this "crisis" of PTSD so now all Navy and Marine Corps vets get this weird psychobabble and they practically push meds at you.

I think its so that we can't own guns someday because of mental health issues, but I could just be cynical.

jillian
09-27-2013, 06:44 PM
I don't like the military's obsession with raising "awareness" about PTSD in combat vets. Everyone already knows about it - in WWII they called it "shell shock" - nowadays, it's all over the place and it's creating this image of veterans as unstable and potentially dangerous. There ARE some people who have real combat PTSD and they CAN be dangerous and unstable, but those guys are few and far between and it's because it takes some REAL stuff to break someone down like that. The rest of the "PTSD" cases are just guys who want money or who had pre-existing psychological issues that were brought to the surface through the stress of combat. We need to stop peddling this PTSD cottage industry because it's inaccurate and does a disservice to the vast majority of veterans who do not suffer from PTSD.

because they think if they bring it to enough people's attention a) they'll donate money; and b) make enough noise that vets don't have to wait almost a year to see a shrink.

it's called ACTUALLY supporting the troops instead of pretend patriotism

our vets commit suicide at the rate of what may be 22 a day.

that's why

sorry it bores you

Codename Section
09-27-2013, 06:54 PM
because they think if they bring it to enough people's attention a) they'll donate money; and b) make enough noise that vets don't have to wait almost a year to see a shrink.

it's called ACTUALLY supporting the troops instead of pretend patriotism

our vets commit suicide at the rate of what may be 22 a day.

that's why

sorry it bores you

Hes a combat deployed Marine veteran of Iraq, jillian. We both are. It doesn't bore us. We just see it for what it is.

jillian
09-27-2013, 06:57 PM
Hes a combat deployed Marine veteran of Iraq, @jillian (http://thepoliticalforums.com/member.php?u=719). We both are. It doesn't bore us. We just see it for what it is.

fair enough. but is it a bad thing to have people actively making noise to get troops what they need?

i'm sorry... i'm not that cynical.

and if it's such a terrible thing, why are groups like IAVA working so hard?

Codename Section
09-27-2013, 07:05 PM
fair enough. but is it a bad thing to have people actively making noise to get troops what they need?

i'm sorry... i'm not that cynical.

and if it's such a terrible thing, why are groups like IAVA working so hard?

I appreciate the people I love and military families helping. I do. I had multiple combat deploys mostly to Afghanistan and I don't have "shell shock" or "PTSD", and when people try to push it on me, or label me I get pissed.

No one wants to be called crazy, especially after the strength of will to "keep it tight" and to get the job done. You just want a "good job", not a "crazy vet" label.

jillian
09-27-2013, 07:10 PM
I appreciate the people I love and military families helping. I do. I had multiple combat deploys mostly to Afghanistan and I don't have "shell shock" or "PTSD", and when people try to push it on me, or label me I get pissed.

No one wants to be called crazy, especially after the strength of will to "keep it tight" and to get the job done. You just want a "good job", not a "crazy vet" label.

totally get that. and i don't think anyone is implying that all vets have PTSD or that people with PTSD are "crazy". but large numbers of people who had abusively repeated deployments are having enough trouble where they're killing themselves.

like i said. no one should have to wait almost a year to see a shrink when they served their country. my maternal grandfather whom i never met, was a POW in germany (they actually did a movie about his group of soldiers where only one guy survived, i can't remember the name of the flick)...and he had nightmares about his experience until the day he died. no one ever knew why until after he died and they found records in an old bible.

maybe he'd have appreciated a little help

Codename Section
09-27-2013, 07:13 PM
totally get that. and i don't think anyone is implying that all vets have PTSD or that people with PTSD are "crazy". but large numbers of people who had abusively repeated deployments are having enough trouble where they're killing themselves.

like i said. no one should have to wait almost a year to see a shrink when they served their country. my maternal grandfather whom i never met, was a POW in germany (they actually did a movie about his group of soldiers where only one guy survived, i can't remember the name of the flick)...and he had nightmares about his experience until the day he died. no one ever knew why until after he died and they found records in an old bible.

maybe he'd have appreciated a little help

Oh. I am with you on the VA getting cleaned up. I just don't think they need to "bull pen" us when we come off deployment or feed us meds, is all.

jillian
09-27-2013, 07:14 PM
Oh. I am with you on the VA getting cleaned up. I just don't think they need to "bull pen" us when we come off deployment or feed us meds, is all.

fair enough. i agree.

Mr Happy
09-27-2013, 07:15 PM
Marie_archer has been banned from this thread.

Because???

Libhater
09-28-2013, 05:20 AM
Oh. I am with you on the VA getting cleaned up. I just don't think they need to "bull pen" us when we come off deployment or feed us meds, is all.

I agree with both you and jillian here. I guess times have changed since the seventies and the eighties when no combat veteran was encouraged to seek help for PTSD.

I do believe the reason why my father physically abused me was because of the great chance he had suffered from PTSD as a combat veteran of WWII, and with the fact that the VA system wasn't up to snuff in handling such cases. It took me years of joining a vet center and talking to a counselor there before even knowing what the term PTSD meant and that there was a good possibility that I had been suffering from it. That particular counselor just happened to have been rated with a 30% disability for PTSD.

Its hard for me to imagine that the VA is pushing those anti depressant drugs on cherry veterans as well. Sure, those vets going through years of therapy and become service connected with PTSD will have offers from psyhes to try out one or more of their psychotropic drugs, but there are just as many psyches who prefer to tell you to go it el natural. I refused to take their offers to pop Prozac and or a bevy of other mind altering pills. Even with my trouble sleeping I won't take Ambien or Trazadone etc.

Codename Section
09-28-2013, 08:41 AM
I agree with both you and jillian here. I guess times have changed since the seventies and the eighties when no combat veteran was encouraged to seek help for PTSD.

I do believe the reason why my father physically abused me was because of the great chance he had suffered from PTSD as a combat veteran of WWII, and with the fact that the VA system wasn't up to snuff in handling such cases. It took me years of joining a vet center and talking to a counselor there before even knowing what the term PTSD meant and that there was a good possibility that I had been suffering from it. That particular counselor just happened to have been rated with a 30% disability for PTSD.

Its hard for me to imagine that the VA is pushing those anti depressant drugs on cherry veterans as well. Sure, those vets going through years of therapy and become service connected with PTSD will have offers from psyhes to try out one or more of their psychotropic drugs, but there are just as many psyches who prefer to tell you to go it el natural. I refused to take their offers to pop Prozac and or a bevy of other mind altering pills. Even with my trouble sleeping I won't take Ambien or Trazadone etc.


My father was a Vietnam veteran and career military marine. You just didn't talk about shell shock in his generation, and I know they didn't offer a lot of help for men of that generation. Unfortunately today it's the opposite.

I have a buddy who lost a foot to an explosive and he probably qualifies for it. His wife says he wakes up screaming in bed, and I'm supposed to help her talk him into going to see someone. The problem is that in order to get the benefits there is a lot of control and monitoring exerted over you that makes people less likely to want to see a military doctor for it.

Me? I had a dude in my own platoon accidentally shoot me in the leg--dickhead--and other than being fanatical about gun safety and people around me with guns I'm pretty ok.

I do have some issues, but I think they're normal given the circumstances. Loud bangs make me go into "take cover" mode. I see people from the Middle East and I become hyper aware of everything in my vicinity, almost in a surreal way, but all in all I don't see that as worthy of psychiatric evaluation anymore than Alyosha and her fear of bridges. :)

Dr. Who
09-28-2013, 10:22 AM
I agree with both you and jillian here. I guess times have changed since the seventies and the eighties when no combat veteran was encouraged to seek help for PTSD.

I do believe the reason why my father physically abused me was because of the great chance he had suffered from PTSD as a combat veteran of WWII, and with the fact that the VA system wasn't up to snuff in handling such cases. It took me years of joining a vet center and talking to a counselor there before even knowing what the term PTSD meant and that there was a good possibility that I had been suffering from it. That particular counselor just happened to have been rated with a 30% disability for PTSD.

Its hard for me to imagine that the VA is pushing those anti depressant drugs on cherry veterans as well. Sure, those vets going through years of therapy and become service connected with PTSD will have offers from psyhes to try out one or more of their psychotropic drugs, but there are just as many psyches who prefer to tell you to go it el natural. I refused to take their offers to pop Prozac and or a bevy of other mind altering pills. Even with my trouble sleeping I won't take Ambien or Trazadone etc.

I don't think that PTSD causes people to abuse their children. Usually that comes from their own childhood experience, although there is the possibility of an unresolved head injury that can produce anger control issues.

Peter1469
09-28-2013, 10:27 AM
I don't think that PTSD causes people to abuse their children. Usually that comes from their own childhood experience, although there is the possibility of an unresolved head injury that can produce anger control issues.

PTSD doesn't cause people to abuse people or commit crimes. It does cause them to withdraw from society and lose self confidence. Just my opinion.

Codename Section
09-28-2013, 10:42 AM
The military invested money into PTSD research and what they found is that it creates a "glitch" in the brain where when it is activated the individual feels trapped temporarily in a moment. The developed a treatment method called "trauma resolution therapy" which helps to take the brain out of that moment.

jillian
09-28-2013, 10:43 AM
PTSD doesn't cause people to abuse people or commit crimes. It does cause them to withdraw from society and lose self confidence. Just my opinion.

Most people who are abusive were abused themselves.

Dr. Who
09-28-2013, 10:48 AM
Most people who are abusive were abused themselves.
An unfortunate legacy, although as I mentioned, certain types of head injuries can result in an inability to control anger and a propensity toward violent behavior, particularly when there has been no recognition of the injury.

sky dancer
09-28-2013, 09:40 PM
Interesting thread.

Libhater
09-29-2013, 04:58 AM
Most people who are abusive were abused themselves.

The key word there being...'MOST', for I have two children myself and I never abused them either emotionally or physically. Peter was correct in saying that many PTSDers seem to withdraw from society, with the worst cases ending up in suicide.

jillian
09-29-2013, 05:03 AM
The key word there being...'MOST', for I have two children myself and I never abused them either emotionally or physically. Peter was correct in saying that many PTSDers seem to withdraw from society, with the worst cases ending up in suicide.

i said most... and there are many people who would have been considered abused who never abused their own families.

my own father says he never hit us because he was always afraid he wouldn't stop. (which should tell you a bit about his upbringing).