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Chris
10-15-2013, 02:58 PM
Interview of author Ira Stoll on his new book, JFK, Conservative.

John F. Kennedy Was a Conservative (http://reason.com/archives/2013/10/14/john-f-kennedy-was-a-conservative)


...Q. Why is the title of the book JFK, Conservative and not JFK, Libertarian?

A. There’s a lot in the book that will probably resonate with libertarians. Kennedy was likely influenced by a libertarian writer called Albert Jay Nock. Early in his political career, JFK gave some amazing speeches about the individual versus the state. On January 29, 1950, at Notre Dame, he said, “The ever expanding power of the federal government, the absorption of many of the functions that states and cities once considered to be the responsibilities of their own, must now be a source of concern to all those who believe as did the Irish Patriot, Henry Grattan: ‘Control over local affairs is the essence of liberty.’” And the Inaugural Address line “Ask not what your country can do for you” was a call for self-reliance and an attack on the welfare state. Other parts, like Kennedy’s foreign policy and his stance on some social issues, libertarians might find less attractive.

Q. What about the space program and the Peace Corps?

A. These are sometimes cited as examples of Kennedy’s liberalism. But Kennedy made it clear that the space program was aimed at beating the Soviet Union. “Otherwise we shouldn’t be spending this kind of money, because I’m not that interested in space,” he told a NASA official in one budget meeting. The Peace Corps was also a Cold War program — Kennedy’s justification for it was that if Americans didn’t go help developing countries, the Soviets would gain dominance in the developing world with their own teams of engineers, teachers, and health advisers.

Q. If Kennedy was such a right-winger, why does anyone think he was a liberal?

A. Two of his more liberal aides, Theodore Sorensen and Arthur Schlesinger, Jr., wrote books that, as I show in my book, subtly spun the record of the administration in their own political direction. JFK, alas, wasn’t around to correct those accounts.

Q. What do you think the reaction will be to your book?

A. As President Reagan put it in 1984, “Whenever I talk about…John F. Kennedy, my opponents start tearing their hair out. They just can’t stand it.”...

Green Arrow
10-15-2013, 04:22 PM
I don't think I'd agree with that. He certainly had some conservative influences and actions, but I don't think the overall record was conservative.

AmazonTania
10-15-2013, 04:56 PM
If he were alive today, he would be a conservative, based on his overall implemented/intended policies.

jillian
10-15-2013, 05:03 PM
If he were alive today, he would be a conservative, based on his overall implemented/intended policies.

not socially, he wouldn't be

so you'd call him a socialist

and he'd never believe in trickle down voodoo economics.

nice try, though.

AmazonTania
10-15-2013, 05:11 PM
not socially, he wouldn't be

so you'd call him a socialist

and he'd never believe in trickle down voodoo economics.

nice try, though.

He advocated for a tax cut for the Top Marginal Rate from 91% to 75% during his state of the union address, as well as a reduction in the Corporate Tax Rate. That's 'Trickle Down Economics' according to you economic illiterates.

Nice revisionist history, though. If I didn't know better, I'd say you attended public school.

http://www.presidency.ucsb.edu/ws/?pid=9138#axzz2hpbsEihg

Green Arrow
10-15-2013, 05:16 PM
If he were alive today, he would be a conservative, based on his overall implemented/intended policies.

Uhm...no, he wouldn't. For one thing, he would be horrified at the social policies of today's conservatives. He was all about stimulus spending, which done the way he did it actually helped pull us out of the 1961 recession. He created the first food stamps program that would later give birth to the food stamp program we have now during the Johnson administration. During the first Nixon-Kennedy debate in 1960, he advocated for expanding the nation's welfare programs over cutting the deficit.

I'm looking over his record and I'm honestly not seeing much conservatism.

Chris
10-15-2013, 05:17 PM
Being socially liberal is not being a socialist, that's ludicrous.


Kennedy had Keynesian economic advisors, "a rising tide lifts all boats" is trickle down. And Kennedy cut taxes: A Rising Tide . . . In More Ways than One: The wisdom of the JFK-Reagan-Bush tax-cut model:


What is strange about this story is that Democrats used to be for tax cuts. As du Pont pointed out, John F. Kennedy espoused revenue-producing tax cuts when he said that “an economy hampered by restrictive tax rates will never produce enough revenue to balance our budget, just as it will never produce enough jobs or enough profits.”

Time changes the meaning of political labels, Democrats were more conservative back then.


I don't know how conservative he was as the interviewer focused on libertarian aspects.

AmazonTania
10-15-2013, 05:29 PM
Uhm...no, he wouldn't. For one thing, he would be horrified at the social policies of today's conservatives. He was all about stimulus spending, which done the way he did it actually helped pull us out of the 1961 recession. He created the first food stamps program that would later give birth to the food stamp program we have now during the Johnson administration. During the first Nixon-Kennedy debate in 1960, he advocated for expanding the nation's welfare programs over cutting the deficit.

I'm looking over his record and I'm honestly not seeing much conservatism.

1. Kennedy's Predecessor used stimulus spending. Kennedy was a deficit hawk indicated by Federal Expenditures. The recession ended before Kennedy took office.



http://research.stlouisfed.org/fredgraph.png?g=noU


2. Kennedy advocated an increase in defense spending.

3. He was a big advocate of simplifying the tax system and reducing tax burdens for individuals and corporations.

4. Most of all, he wanted to reign in the powers of the Federal Reserve. He halted the sales of silver by the US Treasury. This increased the demand for silver, thus increasing the spot price for silver above the Government Price. This also would have eventually phased out the use of Silver Certificates by the Federal Reserve. This initiative was known as Executive Order 11110.

If he wasn't a Conservative, he would have been in Ron Paul's camp to the tee. Either way, he would have been no different from any other conservative today.

nathanbforrest45
10-17-2013, 02:03 PM
Kennedy was far more conservative than John McCain is today. Conservative doesn't mean bring back slavery or women should be in the kitchen, it means government should stay out of your business. I believe Kennedy was much more of that ilk than any Democrat and most Republicans today.

Chris
10-17-2013, 02:16 PM
Kennedy was far more conservative than John McCain is today. Conservative doesn't mean bring back slavery or women should be in the kitchen, it means government should stay out of your business. I believe Kennedy was much more of that ilk than any Democrat and most Republicans today.



Back then Dems were't mostly libs nor Reps cons. This is a more recent phenomenon, let's hope it's temporary.

Ravi
10-17-2013, 02:25 PM
That's funny. My father always swore up and down he was a nasty socialist.

Kabuki Joe
10-17-2013, 02:32 PM
That's funny. My father always swore up and down he was a nasty socialist.

...well, if your father says it, it must be true...

wvtravlr
10-19-2013, 10:53 PM
I dont suppose you knew that Nathan B Forrest was one of the founding members of the Klan??

zelmo1234
10-20-2013, 04:40 AM
not socially, he wouldn't be

so you'd call him a socialist

and he'd never believe in trickle down voodoo economics.

nice try, though.

Actually that is exactly what he did?

http://www.newsmax.com/ThomasSowell/JFK-tax-cuts-economy/2012/11/28/id/465744

And just like every other time in history, it not only increased revenue to the government but also produced jobs and economic growth

How could this be that the liberals have overlooked the tax policy of one of their hero's?

Chris
10-20-2013, 09:59 AM
I dont suppose you knew that Nathan B Forrest was one of the founding members of the Klan??

And that myth has what to do with the topic?

Dr. Who
10-20-2013, 05:53 PM
And that myth has what to do with the topic?I think an observation that one of our members is using that name as their alias.

Mister D
10-20-2013, 05:57 PM
I think an observation that one of our members is using that name as their alias.

If that member understood Forrest's racial views he'd feel a little silly but it's way off topic.

Chris
10-20-2013, 05:59 PM
I think an observation that one of our members is using that name as their alias.

And that's appropriate? And on topic?

Dr. Who
10-20-2013, 06:08 PM
And that's appropriate? And on topic?

No, but unless we continue to discuss it, it is harmless.