PETA Activist really enthusiastic about raping women

[Kabuki Joe]

...hmmmm...


http://frontpagemag.com/2013/dgreenfield/peta-activist-really-enthusiastic-about-raping-women/

[killianr1]

In Georgia PETA is an acronym for

People Eating Tasty Animals.

[Chloe]

Obviously his way of getting his point across isn't super helpful or inviting but he does make some good, provocative points in my opinion. The meat industry for example does forcibly impregnate animals such as pigs, cows, chickens, and so on in order to secure the future of slaughterhouses, and if you are pro-animal rights then it's a pretty disgusting thing to do if you really think about it. Separate yourself from the comparisons to rape and the holocaust and just focus on what happens in the meat and fur industry and it's hard not to see the disgusting nature of it all in my opinion.

[jillian]

Obviously his way of getting his point across isn't super helpful or inviting but he does make some good, provocative points in my opinion. The meat industry for example does forcibly impregnate animals such as pigs, cows, chickens, and so on in order to secure the future of slaughterhouses, and if you are pro-animal rights then it's a pretty disgusting thing to do if you really think about it. Separate yourself from the comparisons to rape and the holocaust and just focus on what happens in the meat and fur industry and it's hard not to see the disgusting nature of it all in my opinion.

while i'm sure we can all agree that animals should be treated humanely, a fish is not a pig is not a dog is not a boy.

[killianr1]

hmmmmmmmm...........pig

[jillian]

hmmmmmmmm...........pig


PETA motto:

it's actually "a rat is a pig is a dog is a boy".

http://www.peta.org/b/thepetafiles/archive/2012/08/28/a-rat-is-a-pig-is-a-dog-is-a-boy.aspx

which is, of course, absurd.

[Dangermouse]

Cannibals don't call it long pig for nothing. The smell of roast pork in the OR when a surgeon cauterises a blood vessel is maddening when you're scrubbed up!

[killianr1]

Repeat....hmmmmmmm........pig

[jillian]

Repeat....hmmmmmmm........pig

i didn't make it up. but i knew what i was referencing.

[jillian]

Cannibals don't call it long pig for nothing. The smell of roast pork in the OR when a surgeon cauterises a blood vessel is maddening when you're scrubbed up!

burning human flesh doesn't smell like anything else... not pig ... not any other animal. it's a horrible smell.

[killianr1]

In Georgia it is

People Eating Tasty Animals


The emphasis is on Tasty

[Chloe]

while i'm sure we can all agree that animals should be treated humanely, a fish is not a pig is not a dog is not a boy.

Ok but at the end of the day we are all living animals with different needs and abilities. The human species does not live or die or feel pain differently from most all other animal species, including the ones that we force produce for slaughter, force participation for testing, or force to entertain us, but the only real difference is that we as a species are under the arrogant assumption that all other life on Earth is meant to live or die at our discretion since we are the only species that can supposedly feel the various "human" emotions that we feel, create the various thoughts and actions that we can create as a species, and understand the ecosystem in a scientific way, when in fact we aren't all that special or unique with those attributes and we have absolutely no idea, if maybe just a small %, of what other animal species feel, communicate, or want, but we assume we do because we are all sooo smart and evolved. (sarcasm)

Take the meat industry part of all of this. Most major meat companies force inseminate living beings so that they can then feed them various combinations of mostly unnatural foods mixed growth hormones so that they can then kill them at various ages and weights so that they can then sell them for maximum profit. If that is an example of "humane" then no wonder so many animal species on Earth run or freeze from fear when they see our species.

[The Xl]

Ok but at the end of the day we are all living animals with different needs and abilities. The human species does not live or die or feel pain differently from most all other animal species, including the ones that we force produce for slaughter, force participation for testing, or force to entertain us, but the only real difference is that we as a species are under the arrogant assumption that all other life on Earth is meant to live or die at our discretion since we are the only species that can supposedly feel the various "human" emotions that we feel, create the various thoughts and actions that we can create as a species, and understand the ecosystem in a scientific way, when in fact we aren't all that special or unique with those attributes and we have absolutely no idea, if maybe just a small %, of what other animal species feel, communicate, or want, but we assume we do because we are all sooo smart and evolved. (sarcasm)

Take the meat industry part of all of this. Most major meat companies force inseminate living beings so that they can then feed them various combinations of mostly unnatural foods mixed growth hormones so that they can then kill at various ages and weights so that they can then sell them for maximum profit. If that is an example of "humane" then no wonder so many animal species on Earth run or freeze from fear when they see our species.

You're a smart, empathetic, kind woman with a lot of perspective.

[nathanbforrest45]

There is a place for all animals. Right next to the mashed potatoes and gravy

[nathanbforrest45]

​save the skeet

[nathanbforrest45]

God gave us canine teeth for a reason and it wasn't for eating tofu.

I don't believe in hunting for the sake of hunting. If you are going to eat that deer then fine and dandy. We should be good stewards of the earth's creatures but they are still mainly FOOD as far as I am concerned.

By the way, did you know the most dangerous animal in the US is the deer. They kill more people than any other animal.

Wait for it

Wait for it

Wait for it


In a whinny voice

What about all the murders people commit?

I said animals not humans. I love my dog but she is a dog and not a small human in a fur coat.

[Mister D]

burning human flesh doesn't smell like anything else... not pig ... not any other animal. it's a horrible smell.

Mouse is right. Real cannibals compared it to pork.

[Mister D]

In an interview in 2006, Yourofsky said that those who wore fur deserved to be brutally raped. “Every woman ensconced in fur should endure a rape so vicious that it scars them forever,” he said. \

They really have a way of alienating people. Fanaticism will do that. That said, I'm quite happy eating only humanely raised animals. I've made a few mistakes and I've given in a few times (I wanted wings so bad one night I said f it) but I'm good 95% of the time.

[Peter1469]

Mouse is right. Real cannibals compared it to pork.

Older versions of the US Army Survival Guide had a chapter on long-pig, or a human. At some point they took it out.

[Mister D]

Older versions of the US Army Survival Guide had a chapter on long-pig, or a human. At some point they took it out.

I'm sure it made for pleasant reading. I can understand why they would include that but no one wants to think about such a situation.

[Peter1469]

I'm sure it made for pleasant reading. I can understand why they would include that but no one wants to think about such a situation.


It came with drawings too.

[Mister D]

lol

[Chloe]

God gave us canine teeth for a reason and it wasn't for eating tofu.

I don't believe in hunting for the sake of hunting. If you are going to eat that deer then fine and dandy. We should be good stewards of the earth's creatures but they are still mainly FOOD as far as I am concerned.

By the way, did you know the most dangerous animal in the US is the deer. They kill more people than any other animal.

Wait for it

Wait for it

Wait for it


In a whinny voice

What about all the murders people commit?

I said animals not humans. I love my dog but she is a dog and not a small human in a fur coat.

With regards to deer you are probably talking about car accidents, and if that is the case then it's not the deer's fault if there is a collision and there is no malice on behalf of the deer, so they aren't really "dangerous". Most animals hurt or kill humans for defensive reasons or by accident, and the predators that hurt or kill humans typically do it either out of desperation, necessity, or because of human interaction by doing things like feeding them and disrupting their natural behavior.

[roadmaster]

I think this guy is a little off. Hunters should only kill for meat like the Native Americans did and we should treat animals with respect and give them a good life while they are here but they are here to feed people. Using their skin or fur as long as you eat them isn't wrong.

[The Xl]

I think this guy is a little off. Hunters should only kill for meat like the Native Americans did and we should treat animals with respect and give them a good life while they are here but they are here to feed people. Using their skin or fur as long as you eat them isn't wrong.

I was with you until this point. Animals aren't meant to be at humans disposal, they are their own unique entities with their own purpose, we just evolved to the point where we can impose our will on them

[roadmaster]

I was with you until this point. Animals aren't meant to be at humans disposal, they are their own unique entities with their own purpose, we just evolved to the point where we can impose our will on them

I disagree. We were put here over them and Jesus feed people with fish and told us what was good to eat. Even as a farmers daughter we were not allowed to disrespect the animals. It makes us mad to see people kicking, putting them in inhumane places and just treating them like they can't feel pain.

[The Xl]

I disagree. We were put here over them and Jesus feed people with fish and told us what was good to eat. Even as a farmers daughter we were not allowed to disrespect the animals. It makes us mad to see people kicking, putting them in inhumane places and just treating them like they can't feel pain.

Well, I'm not a Christian, so I disagree, but I respect your opinion. At least you want to treat animals humanely, and I admire that. Too many times have I heard about/seen unnecessary cruelty, and it makes me sick. And hunters should be good shots, or they have no business hunting.

[Cthulhu]

I'm sure it made for pleasant reading. I can understand why they would include that but no one wants to think about such a situation.

Too bad they took it out. If rations were low and I had prisoners which killed my comrades - they would be dinner. Although cannibalism isn't the healthiest diet out there, it will do in a pinch.

[Cthulhu]

I was with you until this point. Animals aren't meant to be at humans disposal, they are their own unique entities with their own purpose, we just evolved to the point where we can impose our will on them

Do you apply this same thinking to wolves and deer?

[Mister D]

Too bad they took it out. If rations were low and I had prisoners which killed my comrades - they would be dinner. Although cannibalism isn't the healthiest diet out there, it will do in a pinch.

Damn dude...:shocked:

[Cthulhu]

With regards to deer you are probably talking about car accidents, and if that is the case then it's not the deer's fault if there is a collision and there is no malice on behalf of the deer, so they aren't really "dangerous". Most animals hurt or kill humans for defensive reasons or by accident, and the predators that hurt or kill humans typically do it either out of desperation, necessity, or because of human interaction by doing things like feeding them and disrupting their natural behavior.

For the most part, you are entirely correct. Animals prefer to stick to what they know. Unless a predator is sick, threatened, or starving, they generally don't fool with humans.

One of those divine order type of things I reckon.

[Cthulhu]

Damn dude...:shocked:

What? I'd do the same thing to looters in a tight spot. I'd leave a bucket of wheat in a quasi obvious place, tempting the foolish to try and take it. When they do, blam! Same thing if they try to pick my garden's food at night. Blam! Fertilizer and food in one shot.

If you come for my food and such when I have a family to feed? I will feed my family - with the looter.

[Mister D]

remind me not to attempt to pick any of your chili peppers. :shocked:

[nathanbforrest45]

With regards to deer you are probably talking about car accidents, and if that is the case then it's not the deer's fault if there is a collision and there is no malice on behalf of the deer, so they aren't really "dangerous". Most animals hurt or kill humans for defensive reasons or by accident, and the predators that hurt or kill humans typically do it either out of desperation, necessity, or because of human interaction by doing things like feeding them and disrupting their natural behavior.


Talk about splitting hairs. People don't run into cows or horses or aardvarks and cause anywhere near the carnage that deer do. They are dangerous because if you hit one at the very least you are going to do serious damage to your car. Furthermore, because of all the bleeding hearts the deer population is increasing to where they are now out in much more populated areas. On Monday an 18 year old girl was killed when she hit a deer and it went through her windshield on a road I travel every day.

Deer, on the side of the highway are a danger to those in automobiles. Furthermore, deer ticks are a prime source of Lyme Disease which can be fatal.

[Cthulhu]

remind me not to attempt to pick any of your chili peppers. :shocked:

Nah. I don't care much about peppers.

But don't touch my pumpkins...

[nathanbforrest45]

By the way, you are obviously a city dweller. Those of us in rural areas are well aware that deer are not Bambi but can be very destructive to our crops as well as a danger on the road

[nathanbforrest45]

Nah. I don't care much about peppers.

But don't touch my pumpkins...


I like to touch my wife's pumpkins

[Chloe]

For the most part, you are entirely correct. Animals prefer to stick to what they know. Unless a predator is sick, threatened, or starving, they generally don't fool with humans.

One of those divine order type of things I reckon.

Divine order, possibly, but in my opinion it's more complex and interesting than that. Take whale and dolphin pods for example...they have their own language, their own family units and family bonds, they orchestrate strategy for food and for "home" defense, they travel to and from locations in an organized and deliberate way, they feel fear, pain, joy, stress, compassion, and other emotions, however, since they do not drive cars, speak english, work in offices, pass laws, or shop at stores, play sports, or do any other human things we therefore have dominion over them. Even ant colonies work for the common good of the colony, and even though they don't have as noticeable emotional bonds as other animals have it would be very presumptuous of us as a completely different species to assume that they do not know what they are doing, have their own "language", or other attributes. I think human fear and arrogance plays a big part in how we see the Earth and its life, and not so much our intelligence or empathy. Anyway I just think it's an interesting thing to think about.

[Chloe]

Talk about splitting hairs. People don't run into cows or horses or aardvarks and cause anywhere near the carnage that deer do. They are dangerous because if you hit one at the very least you are going to do serious damage to your car. Furthermore, because of all the bleeding hearts the deer population is increasing to where they are now out in much more populated areas. On Monday an 18 year old girl was killed when she hit a deer and it went through her windshield on a road I travel every day.

Deer, on the side of the highway are a danger to those in automobiles. Furthermore, deer ticks are a prime source of Lyme Disease which can be fatal.

So you blame the deer and label them dangerous simply because they cross a road at night and don't adhere to human customs of looking both ways or respecting traffic? You blame a deer for her death when it was simply just an accident involving the encroachment of human construction with natural habitats? A deer on the side of a highway is in just as much danger of losing its life to that car and driver, is the car or driver dangerous? Also the overpopulation of animals like deer comes from habitat loss due to OUR destructive ways of increased expansion which to most wildlife is very very dangerous as well. Human beings are far far far more dangerous than any deer ever will be i'm sorry to say.

[Chloe]

By the way, you are obviously a city dweller. Those of us in rural areas are well aware that deer are not Bambi but can be very destructive to our crops as well as a danger on the road

To us they are destructive by eating what we view as our property, however, to the deer they are just eating, they do not have the concept of human property. They are no more "dangerous" in an offensive way than the poisonous mushroom growing in your yard. Also the road systems are more dangerous to us and to wildlife than that deer is to us.

[Terminal Lance]

Divine order, possibly, but in my opinion it's more complex and interesting than that. Take whale and dolphin pods for example...they have their own language, their own family units and family bonds, they orchestrate strategy for food and for "home" defense, they travel to and from locations in an organized and deliberate way, they feel fear, pain, joy, stress, compassion, and other emotions, however, since they do not drive cars, speak english, work in offices, pass laws, or shop at stores, play sports, or do any other human things we therefore have dominion over them. Even ant colonies work for the common good of the colony, and even though they don't have as noticeable emotional bonds as other animals have it would be very presumptuous of us as a completely different species to assume that they do not know what they are doing, have their own "language", or other attributes. I think human fear and arrogance plays a big part in how we see the Earth and its life, and not so much our intelligence or empathy. Anyway I just think it's an interesting thing to think about.

I think that is very pretty. Seriously. I don't believe in indiscriminate killing either.

However, orcas east seals. Dophins eat fish. They also eat kelp. We're also omnivores/predators. Why must we live on "kelp" and not get to bag a "seal" like an Orca does?

[Chloe]

I think that is very pretty. Seriously. I don't believe in indiscriminate killing either.

However, orcas east seals. Dophins eat fish. They also eat kelp. We're also omnivores/predators. Why must we live on "kelp" and not get to bag a "seal" like an Orca does?

In a natural sense we are more of scavengers and gatherers, since without weaponry, trickery, or trapping we could barely survive hunting anything besides bugs with our natural bodies like most wild predators can and do, so in that sense I don't see humans as the apex predator that we like to think of ourselves as to be very honest with you. We maintain the omnivore in us by eating salad with farm raised animals. There's nothing predatory about that method in my opinion or necessary really. An orca needs to eat animals like seals and seals with fish since they can't farm plants, create markets, gardens, and other ways to supplement like we can. I'm not against a human being eating meat for survival if the situation calls for it, but what I am against is manufacturing the need, if that makes sense. We definitely don't need meat in the same ways that other species do.

[Mister D]

In a natural sense we are more of scavengers and gatherers, since without weaponry, trickery, or trapping we could barely survive hunting anything besides bugs with our natural bodies like most wild predators can and do, so in that sense I don't see humans as the apex predator that we like to think of ourselves as to be very honest with you. We maintain the omnivore in us by eating salad with farm raised animals. There's nothing predatory about that method in my opinion or necessary really. An orca needs to eat animals like seals and seals with fish since they can't farm plants, create markets, gardens, and other ways to supplement like we can. I'm not against a human being eating meat for survival if the situation calls for it, but what I am against is manufacturing the need, if that makes sense. We definitely don't need meat in the same ways that other species do.

It's not manufactured. It's evolved behavior.

[Chloe]

It's not manufactured. It's evolved behavior.

How so? We knowingly choose to eat meat even though we know that we can survive without it and without taking that life. We mass produce and then kill life in order to provide us with a food source that we know is not entirely necessary as our main food. We even mass produce life and then kill that life just to satisfy the manufactured need for a specific holiday like Thanksgiving or a super bowl party. Part of evolution is also about evolving our sense of empathy and what we perceive as worthy life as we become more knowledgable. We choose to put blinders on to cruelty in my opinion and we choose to devalue other forms of life.

[Chloe]

FYI i'm not trying to force you all away from what you want to do or eat, but I do hope that some people at least consider the fact that a lot of our practices as humans when it comes to food production, especially the meat industry, is not very enviable or humane, even though we like to pretend it is. In my mind there are so many wrongs that go into meat production that it's just disgusting to me.

[Kabuki Joe]

\

They really have a way of alienating people. Fanaticism will do that. That said, I'm quite happy eating only humanely raised animals. I've made a few mistakes and I've given in a few times (I wanted wings so bad one night I said f it) but I'm good 95% of the time.


...there's nothing humane in killing an animal for consumption...I don't care how it's raised ultimately it's going to be killed...and there in lies the question, is killing for consumption acceptable?...

[nathanbforrest45]

So you blame the deer and label them dangerous simply because they cross a road at night and don't adhere to human customs of looking both ways or respecting traffic? You blame a deer for her death when it was simply just an accident involving the encroachment of human construction with natural habitats? A deer on the side of a highway is in just as much danger of losing its life to that car and driver, is the car or driver dangerous? Also the overpopulation of animals like deer comes from habitat loss due to OUR destructive ways of increased expansion which to most wildlife is very very dangerous as well. Human beings are far far far more dangerous than any deer ever will be i'm sorry to say.


Did I assign blame to the deer????? I said they were responsible for more human deaths than any other animal, which is quite true. I in no way am implying the deer are like Al Queda Suicide Bombers and lie in wait at the side of the road and hurl themselves in front of automobiles. Deer do what deer do, which is to run into the path of automobiles because they are dumb animals and don't know any better. Holy horse radish, I am not maligning your precious deer, I am merely stating a fact. If cars hit sparrows and this was killing drivers by the thousands then I would have said sparrows are the most dangerous animal.

Give me a break and get off your high horse if I can use another animal reference.

[nathanbforrest45]

So you blame the deer and label them dangerous simply because they cross a road at night and don't adhere to human customs of looking both ways or respecting traffic? You blame a deer for her death when it was simply just an accident involving the encroachment of human construction with natural habitats? A deer on the side of a highway is in just as much danger of losing its life to that car and driver, is the car or driver dangerous? Also the overpopulation of animals like deer comes from habitat loss due to OUR destructive ways of increased expansion which to most wildlife is very very dangerous as well. Human beings are far far far more dangerous than any deer ever will be i'm sorry to say.


No, the overpopulation comes from bleeding hearts stopping hunting and the culling of the herd.

[Chloe]

Did I assign blame to the deer????? I said they were responsible for more human deaths than any other animal, which is quite true. I in no way am implying the deer are like Al Queda Suicide Bombers and lie in wait at the side of the road and hurl themselves in front of automobiles. Deer do what deer do, which is to run into the path of automobiles because they are dumb animals and don't know any better. Holy horse radish, I am not maligning your precious deer, I am merely stating a fact. If cars hit sparrows and this was killing drivers by the thousands then I would have said sparrows are the most dangerous animal.

Give me a break and get off your high horse if I can use another animal reference.

I was asking questions

I'm sorry but you are assigning them blame by calling them dangerous. To the deer and sparrow it's the car and/or driver that is dangerous since that collision can and will also take their lives. Human encroachment into natural habitats can cause accidents, but calling the animal dangerous for doing nothing more than crossing the street that happens to go between its habitat is actually ignoring the root cause of the inevitable accident in my opinion.

[Chloe]

No, the overpopulation comes from bleeding hearts stopping hunting and the culling of the herd.

So when 1000 acres gets demolished for a new neighborhood and the animal population moves on to an already established habitat that is not the fault of humans and habitat loss? And how convenient now for the weekend hunter to be able to go kill other living creatures due to our actions.

[Mister D]

How so? We knowingly choose to eat meat even though we know that we can survive without it and without taking that life. We mass produce and then kill life in order to provide us with a food source that we know is not entirely necessary as our main food. We even mass produce life and then kill that life just to satisfy the manufactured need for a specific holiday like Thanksgiving or a super bowl party. Part of evolution is also about evolving our sense of empathy and what we perceive as worthy life as we become more knowledgable. We choose to put blinders on to cruelty in my opinion and we choose to devalue other forms of life.

We evolved to eat meat. There is no question about that. We did not suddenly decide in 1900 to stock up on cows and start eating them. We've been eating meat for a VERY long time. Industrial scale slaughter houses and the modern meat industry are new. Eating isn't. In fact, we digest meat better than vegetables and grains. A lot better in fact.

[jillian]

So when 1000 acres gets demolished for a new neighborhood and the animal population moves on to an already established habitat that is not the fault of humans and habitat loss? And how convenient now for the weekend hunter to be able to go kill other living creatures due to our actions.


the reality is, though, that the habitat has been limited. and an unculled herd does starve. i don't like hunting. i would never hunt. but i understand hunting.

also, you should know that most of the money raised for wildlife conservation comes from hunters.

[Kabuki Joe]

By the way, you are obviously a city dweller. Those of us in rural areas are well aware that deer are not Bambi but can be very destructive to our crops as well as a danger on the road


...city people make all the rules with regard to wildlife even though they don't suffer the consequences of their actions...it makes me smile when I hear city people cry about their pets getting eaten by coyotes or brutalized by raccoons...

[The Xl]

Do you apply this same thinking to wolves and deer?

Sure. The sole purpose of deer isn't to be fodder for wolves, wolves are just strong enough to impose their will on them.

Plenty of humans have been fodder for animals throughout history, I wouldn't say that makes the human race fodder, would you?

[The Xl]

...city people make all the rules with regard to wildlife even though they don't suffer the consequences of their actions...it makes me smile when I hear city people cry about their pets getting eaten by coyotes or brutalized by raccoons...

Well, someone is a sick fuck.

[Cthulhu]

Sure. The sole purpose of deer isn't to be fodder for wolves, wolves are just strong enough to impose their will on them.

Plenty of humans have been fodder for animals throughout history, I wouldn't say that makes the human race fodder, would you?

No. But not for the reason you think. No other creature is endowed with the faculties we are. Sure, spiders can weave complex webs, and dolphins have amazing spacial insight, but none of them are building light bulbs. Or aircraft.

Humans are not animals. There is an important distinction which needs to be made. We may share some commonalities, but that does not make them anywhere near us in importance or significance.

If my kid was going to die, and the only way to save him was to kill every cow in the world - every cow would die, no questions about it. But if I had to kill another human being? It would never happen.

[Mister D]

No. But not for the reason you think. No other creature is endowed with the faculties we are. Sure, spiders can weave complex webs, and dolphins have amazing spacial insight, but none of them are building light bulbs. Or aircraft.

Humans are not animals. There is an important distinction which needs to be made. We may share some commonalities, but that does not make them anywhere near us in importance or significance.

If my kid was going to die, and the only way to save him was to kill every cow in the world - every cow would die, no questions about it. But if I had to kill another human being? It would never happen.

I tend to agree. Elevating animals to the level of human beings may be well intentioned but seems to end not in the uplifting of animals but in the degradation of human beings.

[Chloe]

No. But not for the reason you think. No other creature is endowed with the faculties we are. Sure, spiders can weave complex webs, and dolphins have amazing spacial insight, but none of them are building light bulbs. Or aircraft.

Humans are not animals. There is an important distinction which needs to be made. We may share some commonalities, but that does not make them anywhere near us in importance or significance.

If my kid was going to die, and the only way to save him was to kill every cow in the world - every cow would die, no questions about it. But if I had to kill another human being? It would never happen.

Most other animals do not need lightbulbs or aircraft, both of which are not necessities of life and survival, but luxuries. When we compare ourselves to other animals we assume that since we can build an ice skating rink that we are superior to them, however, probably 99 out of 100 humans couldn't survive in the natural world with the efficiency and health of most other animals, so in that respect most of nature has dominion over us unless we stay very sheltered in human invention. In my opinion the human species is a fragile, dangerous, intelligent species with very few abilities that actually benefit the natural world and its ecosystems.

For example our lives would be changed in dramatic ways if some of the smallest animals on Earth did not exist, but yet, without our species they'd still thrive and benefit. We give ourselves dominion simply because we created and defined the word and meaning. Nearly all other forms of life exist to benefit the ecosystem in their own unique way and they do not purposefully go out of their way to change it in order to only benefit its species, the concept doesn't exist for them, but on the other hand our perceived intelligence tells ourselves that we exist in order to create and take life, create comfort, advance technologies that are typically meant to promote our species, and that we have dominion over the Earth because someone else said so.

In my opinion, and the opinion of science, is that the human species is an animal, we are mammals. We share anatomy with billions of species. We may not share the same type of intelligence, but human intelligence may not be a great thing for 99% of other animal species, nor does it really matter since we are one out of many. It's again, our arrogance that gives us those thoughts in my opinion. Our significance is only significant to us.

[Cthulhu]

Most other animals do not need lightbulbs or aircraft, both of which are not necessities of life and survival, but luxuries. When we compare ourselves to other animals we assume that since we can build an ice skating rink that we are superior to them, however, probably 99 out of 100 humans couldn't survive in the natural world with the efficiency and health of most other animals, so in that respect most of nature has dominion over us unless we stay very sheltered in human invention. In my opinion the human species is a fragile, dangerous, intelligent species with very few abilities that actually benefit the natural world and its ecosystems.

This is only because of the variance of human morals. Were we all good, nature would continually blossom under our stewardship. If only evil? Well, we are pretty good at wrecking stuff too.

The American buffalo exists only because human being sought to save it. But by the same token, we're also the same ones that nearly annihilated it. Our abilities go both ways.



For example our lives would be changed in dramatic ways if some of the smallest animals on Earth did not exist, but yet, without our species they'd still thrive and benefit. We give ourselves dominion simply because we created and defined the word and meaning. Nearly all other forms of life exist to benefit the ecosystem in their own unique way and they do not purposefully go out of their way to change it in order to only benefit its species, the concept doesn't exist for them, but on the other hand our perceived intelligence tells ourselves that we exist in order to create and take life, create comfort, advance technologies that are typically meant to promote our species, and that we have dominion over the Earth because someone else said so.


This is more or less correct. Humans are the aberration on the planet despite having some similarities with animals.



In my opinion, and the opinion of science, is that the human species is an animal, we are mammals. We share anatomy with billions of species. We may not share the same type of intelligence, but human intelligence may not be a great thing for 99% of other animal species, nor does it really matter since we are one out of many. It's again, our arrogance that gives us those thoughts in my opinion. Our significance is only significant to us.

We share some animals characteristic, even some mammalian traits. But we are not animals. There is a marked difference between us.

I don't think it is arrogance at its core, sure it has an element. But I am pretty sure grasshoppers don't care about anything other than grasshoppers though. Even if they destroy a man's entire crop. Every species has its own interests first. Humans just happen to be the best at it.

I will not elevate a beast to that of a man, nor will a starving wolf decide to pass me by as a meal. We are different. We are superior to animals. Not by arrogance, but by design. That being said, many humans are quite bestial in nature and they discount their innate divinity.

[Mister D]

In my opinion the human species is a fragile, dangerous, intelligent species with very few abilities that actually benefit the natural world and its ecosystems.

Surely you must realize how horribly, horribly wrong such a sentiment could go?

[Cthulhu]

I tend to agree. Elevating animals to the level of human beings may be well intentioned but seems to end not in the uplifting of animals but in the degradation of human beings.

This is due to the limitations of an animal. They can go only so high. But humans seem to have no limit to the depths they can sink. Animals will never approach humans capacity in either good or evil acts.

[Mister D]

This is due to the limitations of an animal. They can go only so high. But humans seem to have no limit to the depths they can sink. Animals will never approach humans capacity in either good or evil acts.

I have to admit the whole idea gives me the creeps although I understand where Chloe is coming from.

[Kabuki Joe]

We evolved to eat meat. There is no question about that. We did not suddenly decide in 1900 to stock up on cows and start eating them. We've been eating meat for a VERY long time. Industrial scale slaughter houses and the modern meat industry are new. Eating isn't. In fact, we digest meat better than vegetables and grains. A lot better in fact.


...and I can't remember where I heard it but there was a theory that the human brain grew to the level it is from meat protein...not plant protein but meat protein...I work with a kid that's anti-meat protein and he calls it un-natural but he can't explain why body builders use meat protein supplements instead of plant protein supplements...meat is where it's at...

[Mister D]

...and I can't remember where I heard it but there was a theory that the human brain grew to the level it is from meat protein...not plant protein but meat protein...I work with a kid that's anti-meat protein and he calls it un-natural but he can't explain why body builders use meat protein supplements instead of plant protein supplements...meat is where it's at...


Yes, I remember it as well. It's said that animal proteins led to greater brain size and thus greater intelligence.

[Kabuki Joe]

the reality is, though, that the habitat has been limited. and an unculled herd does starve. i don't like hunting. i would never hunt. but i understand hunting.

also, you should know that most of the money raised for wildlife conservation comes from hunters.


...there's 2 stories to this topic, #1 we have less game animals and #2 we have more because deer and elk thrive on the tree line which there is more of now then ever...

[jillian]

Sure. The sole purpose of deer isn't to be fodder for wolves, wolves are just strong enough to impose their will on them.

it's called the food chain. the problem is that we overburden the earth's resources.

i think it was george carlin that used to say the earth would go on long after us.... he even opined that perhaps our purpose was to create a new paradigm.... the earth plus plastic.

[nathanbforrest45]

I want to clarify that (1) I don't hunt. I do fish but I do a lot more fishing than I do catching so generally speaking the fish are safe around me. I have nothing against hunters who intend to eat what they kill. I don't understand those who would kill an animal they can't really eat or have any real use for. I even caught the field mice in my basement in a live trap and turned them loose in a neighbors yard! But I don't hold animals on the same level as humans no matter who many PBS Nature programs try to claim otherwise. Yes, some animals are smarter than we originally thought and I am totally convinced dolphins and porpoises can think on the level of a two year old at least.

I will also say this. When I lived in Florida there was a pond at the University of North Florida that was so over run with sunfish that none were much bigger than 2 or 3 inches in length. The reason was none of them got enough food to really grow so the entire "school" were stunted and sickly. They would have been better served if they were fished down to about a third of the population and the remaining fish would be healthy. The same is true for the trout population in the Smokys National Park. The streams won't support the fish that are here and we can't take anything less than 7 inches so almost none of them are "keepers".

We have in many cases upset the balance of nature by driving off natural predators in the case of the deer or by creating false barriers to a natural selection in the case of the fish. I enjoy the wild life and I don't allow hunters on my property for two reasons. One I enjoy the wild life and two I can't trust these guys to not shoot my dog or into my house.

[Cthulhu]

it's called the food chain. the problem is that we overburden the earth's resources.

Pish posh. There is plenty to go around. We mismanage the hell out of it though.

[Chloe]

I have to admit the whole idea gives me the creeps although I understand where @Chloe (http://thepoliticalforums.com/member.php?u=565) is coming from.

Why does it creep you out if I may ask?

[Chloe]

By the way, you are obviously a city dweller. Those of us in rural areas are well aware that deer are not Bambi but can be very destructive to our crops as well as a danger on the road

Yes I live in a city, however, I can promise you that I am very well aware of the ecosystems and wildlife around Portland and the rest of the pacific northwest, and I could fair pretty well in those environments away from home if I had to. I may live and go to school in a city but I spend a lot of time hiking, camping, learning, interacting, and respecting what surrounds me. Living in a rural area does not necessarily make someone an expert or expose them to things that are super unique that a person in a city couldn't learn by simply being involved. I'm well aware that I probably see a wolf or deer or bear in a different light than a farmer or rancher would, but I think that you and I would agree that my approach and goals directed towards those animals would probably be different from a farmer or rancher.

[The Sage of Main Street]

...hmmmm... http://frontpagemag.com/2013/dgreenfield/peta-activist-really-enthusiastic-about-raping-women/

These freaks are dangerous and degenerate mutants who have regressed to the status of animals themselves. Since they are misfits, they hate mankind and should be treated as enemies of the human race.

[The Sage of Main Street]

The meat industry for example does forcibly impregnate animals such as pigs, cows, chickens, and so on in order to secure the future of slaughterhouses, and if you are pro-animal rights then it's a pretty disgusting thing to do if you really think about it. .

If you're so queasy,
You're life won't be so easy.

If when sheltered you discuss,
Then outside all is disgust.

[Chloe]

These freaks are dangerous and degenerate mutants who have regressed to the status of animals themselves. Since they are misfits, they hate mankind and should be treated as enemies of the human race.

For me I don't think it's about hating mankind or anything like that. To me it's about recognizing humanity's flaws and wrongs and then making a conscious effort to address those things and fix those things so that it doesn't continue to damage and/or destroy life around us. We have an arrogance and entitlement that is not only dangerous to our own species but all other species on this planet, and far more dangerous than all other species can ever hope to be in that sense. I don't hate mankind, I just hate a lot of the ways that we interact with our planet and the life that shares it with us.

[Peter1469]

These freaks are dangerous and degenerate mutants who have regressed to the status of animals themselves. Since they are misfits, they hate mankind and should be treated as enemies of the human race.

Wow, put them on the Roman list reserved only for pirates- (Hostis humani generis). A better group to use this on is transnational terrorists.

[Mister D]

Wow, put them on the Roman list reserved only for pirates- (Hostis humani generis). A better group to use this on is transnational terrorists.

That was applied to Jews and later to Christians.

[Mister D]

Why does it creep you out if I may ask?

That's a nice picture of you. :smiley:

It reminds me of animal lovers like Hitler and Himmler. It also reminds me of all the folks I've met in life who love animals but hate people.

[Chloe]

That's a nice picture of you. :smiley:

It reminds me of animal lovers like Hitler and Himmler. It also reminds me of all the folks I've met in life who love animals but hate people.

hmmm I'm not really sure how to take that. I don't hate people.

[Peter1469]

That was applied to Jews and later to Christians.


I haven't heard that. And if it was did it follow the original intent? Pirates were transnational non-state actors committing acts of war all over the Mediterranean. The idea was to let all governments know that with this designation they were free to try and convict any pirate, even if that pirate didn't violate a law within the holding government's jurisdiction.

[Mister D]

hmmm I'm not really sure how to take that. I don't hate people.

I'm not talking about you. I just don't think elevating animals to the level of humans does neither animals or people any good. Like I said earlier, that kind of philosophy ca ad has resulted in the devaluation of human life rather than in better conditions for animals. That is, we start treating each other like animals instead of treating animals like people.

[Chloe]

I'm not talking about you. I just don't think elevating animals to the level of humans does neither animals or people any good. Like I said earlier, that kind of philosophy ca ad has resulted in the devaluation of human life rather than in better conditions for animals. That is, we start treating each other like animals instead of treating animals like people.

I guess for me it comes down to how much do we value life as human beings. Why do we feel it is ok to do the types of things that we do to animals even though they are living, breathing creatures just like us? We do things like test things on them, we inflict pain and suffering on them, we force them to entertain us even though they have no concept of the idea of entertainment, we confine them, we force pregnancy on them and then either sell their baby to someone else, we take parts of them for fashion, kill and eat their baby (veal for example) as some sort of specialty food, or feed it growth hormones to kill later, and that's just some of the things that we do to living beings. There's nothing humane about how we treat most animals on this planet, and for me I think that it's time for a recognition of that and perhaps a move towards treating them in an equal way with regards to life in my opinion.

[Mister D]

I haven't heard that. And if it was did it follow the original intent? Pirates were transnational non-state actors committing acts of war all over the Mediterranean. The idea was to let all governments know that with this designation they were free to try and convict any pirate, even if that pirate didn't violate a law within the holding government's jurisdiction.

It literally means "enemy of humanity" or something like that. The separateness of Jews and later of Christians was deeply suspicious to the Roman mind. Of course I'm referring to social and historical commentators not to legal texts. I don't mean to give that impression. I'm just talking aout the term.

[Mister D]

I guess for me it comes to down how much do we value life as human beings. Why do we feel it is ok to do the types of things that we do to animals even though they are living, breathing creatures just like us? We do things like test things on them, we inflict pain and suffering on them, we force them to entertain us even though they have no concept of the idea of entertainment, we confine them, we force pregnancy on them and then either sell their baby to someone else, we take parts of them for fashion, kill and eat their baby (veal for example) as some sort of specialty food, or feed it growth hormones to kill later, and that's just some of the things that we do to living beings. There's nothing humane about how we treat most animals on this planet, and for me I think that it's time for a recognition of that and perhaps a move towards treating them in an equal way with regards to life in my opinion.

I agree with you on most of that and have changed my diet and habits. There is a point at which I'm uneasy with it. It can taken too far.

[The Sage of Main Street]

If this wannabe rapist decides he can get more media celebrity by switching sides, he'll advocate that stud farms should train their stallions to rape PETA women. Hi, ho, Silver!

[The Sage of Main Street]

In Georgia PETA is an acronym for

People Eating Tasty Animals.

People for the Erotic Treatment of Animals will be the next media celebrity cult. PETA's agenda-driven degenerates are already a baby step away from bestiality.

[The Sage of Main Street]

Older versions of the US Army Survival Guide had a chapter on long-pig, or a human. At some point they took it out.

Syrians become Syrup.

[The Sage of Main Street]

Too bad they took it out. If rations were low and I had prisoners which killed my comrades - they would be dinner. Although cannibalism isn't the healthiest diet out there, it will do in a pinch.

Al Qaida a la carte. Shiite shishkebab. Eggs, sunni side up.

[The Sage of Main Street]

Talk about splitting hairs. People don't run into cows or horses or aardvarks and cause anywhere near the carnage that deer do. They are dangerous because if you hit one at the very least you are going to do serious damage to your car. Furthermore, because of all the bleeding hearts the deer population is increasing to where they are now out in much more populated areas. On Monday an 18 year old girl was killed when she hit a deer and it went through her windshield on a road I travel every day.

Deer, on the side of the highway are a danger to those in automobiles. Furthermore, deer ticks are a prime source of Lyme Disease which can be fatal.

That's the hidden side of all these slimeball movements. If they want us to treat animals like humans, they also want us to treat humans like animals.

[The Sage of Main Street]

By the way, you are obviously a city dweller. Those of us in rural areas are well aware that deer are not Bambi but can be very destructive to our crops as well as a danger on the road

But wouldn't you feel warmier and fuzzier and morally superior if you got your worldview from cartoons?

[The Sage of Main Street]

In a natural sense we are more of scavengers and gatherers, since without weaponry, trickery, or trapping we could barely survive hunting anything besides bugs with our natural bodies like most wild predators can and do, so in that sense I don't see humans as the apex predator that we like to think of ourselves as to be very honest with you. We maintain the omnivore in us by eating salad with farm raised animals. There's nothing predatory about that method in my opinion or necessary really. An orca needs to eat animals like seals and seals with fish since they can't farm plants, create markets, gardens, and other ways to supplement like we can. I'm not against a human being eating meat for survival if the situation calls for it, but what I am against is manufacturing the need, if that makes sense. We definitely don't need meat in the same ways that other species do.

The ruling class enables Veganism in order to turn us into cowards. Nature re-inforces itself. For most of human existence, it took a lot of courage to kill a wild animal with little more than sticks and stones. So eating meat still gives courage, even though any wimp can go to Kroger's.

An example of this scheme by the 1% was the most oppressive and talent-destroying system ever: the Hindu caste system. Guess what caste was allowed to eat meat? The military caste, who because they were Heirheads could only overpower the coward castes. The cancer of hereditary power and its Vegan metastasis made India so weak that 30,000 British soldiers conquered hundreds of millions of Indians.

Another example is the answer to "What do they call the most important unit of the British military, the one that guards the royals?" They are called Beefeaters.

[The Sage of Main Street]

How so? We knowingly choose to eat meat even though we know that we can survive without it and without taking that life. We mass produce and then kill life in order to provide us with a food source that we know is not entirely necessary as our main food. We even mass produce life and then kill that life just to satisfy the manufactured need for a specific holiday like Thanksgiving or a super bowl party. Part of evolution is also about evolving our sense of empathy and what we perceive as worthy life as we become more knowledgable. We choose to put blinders on to cruelty in my opinion and we choose to devalue other forms of life.

If you really had a conscience, you would question whether what makes you feel good about your moral superiority is really a submission to a malignant impulse to treat the rest of mankind with cruelty.

[The Sage of Main Street]

Did I assign blame to the deer????? I said they were responsible for more human deaths than any other animal, which is quite true. I in no way am implying the deer are like Al Queda Suicide Bombers and lie in wait at the side of the road and hurl themselves in front of automobiles. Deer do what deer do, which is to run into the path of automobiles because they are dumb animals and don't know any better. Holy horse radish, I am not maligning your precious deer, I am merely stating a fact. If cars hit sparrows and this was killing drivers by the thousands then I would have said sparrows are the most dangerous animal.

Give me a break and get off your high horse if I can use another animal reference.

Next these mutant misanthropes will want us to worship the worm.

[Kabuki Joe]

Ok but at the end of the day we are all living animals with different needs and abilities. The human species does not live or die or feel pain differently from most all other animal species, including the ones that we force produce for slaughter, force participation for testing, or force to entertain us, but the only real difference is that we as a species are under the arrogant assumption that all other life on Earth is meant to live or die at our discretion since we are the only species that can supposedly feel the various "human" emotions that we feel, create the various thoughts and actions that we can create as a species, and understand the ecosystem in a scientific way, when in fact we aren't all that special or unique with those attributes and we have absolutely no idea, if maybe just a small %, of what other animal species feel, communicate, or want, but we assume we do because we are all sooo smart and evolved. (sarcasm)

Take the meat industry part of all of this. Most major meat companies force inseminate living beings so that they can then feed them various combinations of mostly unnatural foods mixed growth hormones so that they can then kill them at various ages and weights so that they can then sell them for maximum profit. If that is an example of "humane" then no wonder so many animal species on Earth run or freeze from fear when they see our species.


...get out of the hole...

[The Sage of Main Street]

So when 1000 acres gets demolished for a new neighborhood and the animal population moves on to an already established habitat that is not the fault of humans and habitat loss? And how convenient now for the weekend hunter to be able to go kill other living creatures due to our actions.

Another gungrabbing snob seeking to disarm us uncouth peasants.

[The Sage of Main Street]

I tend to agree. Elevating animals to the level of human beings may be well intentioned but seems to end not in the uplifting of animals but in the degradation of human beings.

Despite what the media make you believe, these malignant freaks are not well-intentioned at all. Unzip the costume of an idealist and you will find a vicious lizard inside.

[Kabuki Joe]

In a natural sense we are more of scavengers and gatherers, since without weaponry, trickery, or trapping we could barely survive hunting anything besides bugs with our natural bodies like most wild predators can and do, so in that sense I don't see humans as the apex predator that we like to think of ourselves as to be very honest with you. We maintain the omnivore in us by eating salad with farm raised animals. There's nothing predatory about that method in my opinion or necessary really. An orca needs to eat animals like seals and seals with fish since they can't farm plants, create markets, gardens, and other ways to supplement like we can. I'm not against a human being eating meat for survival if the situation calls for it, but what I am against is manufacturing the need, if that makes sense. We definitely don't need meat in the same ways that other species do.


...and this is why I have you on ignore...I'm punching myself in the face for viewing this...

[The Sage of Main Street]

Most other animals do not need lightbulbs or aircraft, both of which are not necessities of life and survival, but luxuries. When we compare ourselves to other animals we assume that since we can build an ice skating rink that we are superior to them, however, probably 99 out of 100 humans couldn't survive in the natural world with the efficiency and health of most other animals, so in that respect most of nature has dominion over us unless we stay very sheltered in human invention. In my opinion the human species is a fragile, dangerous, intelligent species with very few abilities that actually benefit the natural world and its ecosystems.

For example our lives would be changed in dramatic ways if some of the smallest animals on Earth did not exist, but yet, without our species they'd still thrive and benefit. We give ourselves dominion simply because we created and defined the word and meaning. Nearly all other forms of life exist to benefit the ecosystem in their own unique way and they do not purposefully go out of their way to change it in order to only benefit its species, the concept doesn't exist for them, but on the other hand our perceived intelligence tells ourselves that we exist in order to create and take life, create comfort, advance technologies that are typically meant to promote our species, and that we have dominion over the Earth because someone else said so.

In my opinion, and the opinion of science, is that the human species is an animal, we are mammals. We share anatomy with billions of species. We may not share the same type of intelligence, but human intelligence may not be a great thing for 99% of other animal species, nor does it really matter since we are one out of many. It's again, our arrogance that gives us those thoughts in my opinion. Our significance is only significant to us.

Your halo of moral superiority is just a Ninja's throatcutter.

[The Sage of Main Street]

Surely you must realize how horribly, horribly wrong such a sentiment could go?

More proof that they are enemies of the human race and must be treated as such.

[The Sage of Main Street]

...and I can't remember where I heard it but there was a theory that the human brain grew to the level it is from meat protein...not plant protein but meat protein...I work with a kid that's anti-meat protein and he calls it un-natural but he can't explain why body builders use meat protein supplements instead of plant protein supplements...meat is where it's at...

Vegans want to turn us into vegetables.

[The Sage of Main Street]

Wow, put them on the Roman list reserved only for pirates- (Hostis humani generis). A better group to use this on is transnational terrorists.

But PETA misanthropes are the hostes with the mostest.

[Chloe]

Another gungrabbing snob seeking to disarm us uncouth peasants.

Ive never been called a snob before. Believe what you'd like.

[Chloe]

Vegans want to turn us into vegetables.

No, most, if not all, just want people to consider the wrongs involving meat production, animal testing, animals for entertainment and so on, but for most it's just a personal and moral choice.

[Chloe]

...and this is why I have you on ignore...I'm punching myself in the face for viewing this...

I don't have anybody on ignore. I'm not afraid to read or consider alternative points of view even if I think thy are wrong.

[Chloe]

Your halo of moral superiority is just a Ninja's throatcutter.

No, no it's not. What have I said that isn't true?

[Chloe]

...get out of the hole...

Open your eyes