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Codename Section
12-09-2013, 12:57 PM
This is my problem with how things are now. Police are like the Spanish Inquisition, fully authorized to fuck your shit up for the state.

People need to defund their police departments until such time as they can get them back under control with new protocols that say that police can't use force unless they are certain their lives are on the line.


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Xin63Qu7B5Y&feature=youtu.be

Max Rockatansky
12-09-2013, 01:17 PM
A slap to the head for a kid biting a police officer is an appropriate self-defense action. Categorizing it as a punch is pure BS.

http://excoplawstudent.wordpress.com/tag/eugene-oregon/

Eugene, Oregon Police were called upon to enforce a child custody order on August 4, 2013. The child, a 10-year-old boy was told to run by his mother’s friends when the police arrived and an officer had to chase him for three blocks to catch him. On his way back to the police car, a female friend of the mother showed up and started filming the encounter. At about 1:05 in the video another child shows up and starts cursing the officer and telling him to let go of the kid who just ran.

LOL, yeah, right. I’ve been there when other officers have been that stupid and then I had to chase the idiot too. There was no way the officer was going to let go of the kid.


Then, at 1:07 in the video, you clearly see the kid bite the officer’s arm. The officer reacts by lightly popping the kid on the forehead with an open hand, whereupon the female filming the encounter loses it. She starts screaming bloody murder about the officer f’ing hitting a child.


OK. So? If the child was attached to my arm by his teeth, I would have done the same. And based on the response at PoliceOne, so would most other officers. Actions have consequences, and biting an officer will obtain an appropriate response, like the one by this officer.


The rest of the video is fairly mundane, but I will note that the mother (Stephanie Johnston) lives in a bus and is proud that she hands out clean socks to people in the park. She also never sent her son to school and it is reported that he is illiterate. The videographer mentioned several times that her kids were taken away from her (gee, why does that not surprise me). Overall, the police exercised restraint with the crowd that gathered.


And some people wonder why police think that people ought to pass a test and get a license to have children…

jillian
12-09-2013, 01:18 PM
Codename Section I can't watch youtube at work, but if the kid was biting the officer did you expect the officer to keep letting himself get bit?

Codename Section
12-09-2013, 01:25 PM
So when your child bit you as a little kid you punched him in the face? I doubt it.

I can restrain a grown person without punching them. I'm sure you can do it to a kid.

jillian
12-09-2013, 01:27 PM
So when your child bit you as a little kid you punched him in the face? I doubt it.

I can restrain a grown person without punching them. I'm sure you can do it to a kid.


again, i can't watch the video. RW described it as basically the cop gibbs smacking the kid, not punching him in the face. i'm trying to clarify what was actually done. some things are excusable. some not.

Codename Section
12-09-2013, 01:33 PM
again, i can't watch the video. RW described it as basically the cop gibbs smacking the kid, not punching him in the face. i'm trying to clarify what was actually done. some things are excusable. some not.

Watch it when you get home. If someone hit my kid like that there would be problems. My mom would have gone to jail for assaulting a police officer.

Codename Section
12-09-2013, 01:35 PM
Again, I managed to police Iraq in 2008 with typical bullshit violence my way without hitting, shooting, or abusing people. This was in a war zone.

Cops have new protocols that allow them to do things our own military can't do in war zones.

I find this fucked up.

The Sage of Main Street
12-09-2013, 01:41 PM
A slap to the head for a kid biting a police officer is an appropriate self-defense action. Categorizing it as a punch is pure BS.

http://excoplawstudent.wordpress.com/tag/eugene-oregon/

Obviously, the permanently stunted little brat had never been spanked by his Mommy or Daddy. The same goes for the useless bitch who screamed bloody murder.

Codename Section
12-09-2013, 01:44 PM
Obviously, the permanently stunted little brat had never been spanked by his Mommy or Daddy. The same goes for the useless bitch who screamed bloody murder.

You know this? I got a belt and fists taken to me and I was still a shithead before the Marine Corps.

Nice, deflection, though. The topic is police protocols. They are to protect and serve. This is not a desk job. There is danger to it. Don't take the job if you can't deal with what comes with it.

Max Rockatansky
12-09-2013, 01:52 PM
So when your child bit you as a little kid you punched him in the face? I doubt it.
No and the police officer didn't punch the kid either. A slap to the top of the head isn't a punch. You can say it was as many times as you like, but anyone with eyes can see that isn't so.

It appears the mother, allegedly living in a bus with the kid, never let him go to school and he's illiterate. Probably the reason the court ordered the father to retain custody of the child.

http://www.theblaze.com/stories/2013/08/07/caught-on-video-chaos-and-screaming-erupt-after-oregon-cop-appears-to-smack-10-year-old-boy/

The incident began when officers responded to a child custody issue.

The boy has for the last few years been in the custody of his 28-year-old mother, Stephanie Johnston, against a court order, lanetoday.com reported, citing EPD officers.


Law enforcement officials believe the boy never attended school and is supposedly illiterate.


The boy’s father, Brian Wolfe, has a court order awarding him full custody. Johnston, on the other hand, has been denied any parenting time with the boy.


Police reportedly found the boy living with his mother in a bus at a local park.


When the officers came to take the boy, the mother allegedly told him to make a run for it because the police were coming to take him away, KLTV.com reported.


After a brief foot chase, officers apprehended the boy and returned him to Wolfe — but not before being surrounded and threatened by a gaggle of outraged citizens.


“You don’t know who you’re messing with!” a shirtless youth shouts at police officers before threatening to use his Mexican mafia connections to “blow up” whatever orphanage or juvenile hall the 10-year-old may be held in.

The Xl
12-09-2013, 02:32 PM
I could have restrained an 8 year old that bit me with ease when I was 12.

Cops are thugs. Something needs to be done about their ability to do whatever they wish without the normal citizen being able to defend themselves against them. They're like gang members with the law and the courts behind them.

KC
12-09-2013, 02:42 PM
This is my problem with how things are now. Police are like the Spanish Inquisition, fully authorized to fuck your shit up for the state.

People need to defund their police departments until such time as they can get them back under control with new protocols that say that police can't use force unless they are certain their lives are on the line.


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Xin63Qu7B5Y&feature=youtu.be

I agree that the police officer overreacted, no adult should hit a kid that small, but I would say this is an isolated incident, the poor judgement of a single officer.

nathanbforrest45
12-09-2013, 03:11 PM
He should have pepper sprayed the kid.

Codename Section
12-09-2013, 03:16 PM
I can't wait til this happens to someone you all know and love. We should of course have the government anal raping people for traffic stops and slapping kids upside the head.

KC
12-09-2013, 03:25 PM
I can't wait til this happens to someone you all know and love. We should of course have the government anal raping people for traffic stops and slapping kids upside the head.

This one hit too close to home:


Four Milwaukee police officers were charged Tuesday with felonies related to illegal rectal searches of suspects on the street and in police district stations over the past two years.
In one case, an officer held a gun to a man's head as two others held his arms and a third put him in a choke hold while jamming a hand into his anus, purportedly searching for evidence, according to the criminal complaint. Another man bled from his rectum for several days after his encounter with police, the complaint says.
The complaint (http://media.jsonline.com/documents/Criminal+Complaint_Vagnini+Michael+et+al.pdf) lays out in graphic detail how the primary suspect, Officer Michael Vagnini, conducted searches of men's anal and scrotal areas, often inserting his fingers into their rectums. Vagnini acknowledged performing one of the searches. At least one suspect said Vagnini planted drugs on him.
State law and police procedures prohibit officers from conducting cavity searches. Only medical personnel are allowed to perform them, and police must first obtain a search warrant.


http://www.jsonline.com/news/crime/criminal-charges-against-police-in-strip-search-case-expected-today-gf5cb94-173312411.html

Cthulhu
12-09-2013, 03:37 PM
I can't wait til this happens to someone you all know and love. We should of course have the government anal raping people for traffic stops and slapping kids upside the head.

If we don't stop this crap now...



This one hit too close to home:
http://www.jsonline.com/news/crime/criminal-charges-against-police-in-strip-search-case-expected-today-gf5cb94-173312411.html

...this is what we will have to get used to in the future. Soviet Union didn't just happen overnight.

Should he have hit the kid? Well, no, he shouldn't have. But at the same time the kid shouldn't have bitten him either. I'd say both were in the wrong here.

But seriously, a grown man cannot properly subdue an 8 year old boy? Hell, I've done that in church before - no injury and no marks on either side. There is very little reason to strike a kid like that.

...and this occurs while they are taking the child to a better place? Yeah.

Stupids cops make themselves easy to hate man.

Codename Section
12-09-2013, 03:40 PM
I could have restrained him without getting bit. We are trained for that shit.

Cthulhu
12-09-2013, 03:45 PM
I could have restrained him without getting bit. We are trained for that shit.

Half nelson, solved. Or just grab the kid by the scruff of the neck.

But the old fall back is brute force, because the guys using the force are brutes, and have the mentality of brutes.

When people start hunting them down for stuff like this, and forced illegal cavity searches, and off-camera assaults, stuff will change.

But until people get the gumption to do something about it, this will get worse.

jillian
12-09-2013, 03:46 PM
Obviously, the permanently stunted little brat had never been spanked by his Mommy or Daddy. The same goes for the useless bitch who screamed bloody murder.

so you think you should teach a child that the way to deal with adversity is physical abuse?

useless bitch?

you don't have a wife or kids, do you?

Peter1469
12-09-2013, 04:04 PM
@Codename Section (http://thepoliticalforums.com/member.php?u=866) I can't watch youtube at work, but if the kid was biting the officer did you expect the officer to keep letting himself get bit?

There are plenty of compliance holds that are effective and harmless.

jillian
12-09-2013, 04:06 PM
There are plenty of compliance holds that are effective and harmless.

listen... i'm not going to justify it. especially given that i can't see the video. i think the police often react too quickly and inappropriately.

but i'd also guess that he got startled and it hurt.

that said, i'd have to watch the video before fully commenting. right now i have more questions than responses.

nathanbforrest45
12-09-2013, 04:09 PM
I could have restrained him without getting bit. We are trained for that shit.


Send them your phone number so the next time it happens they can call you in as their unruly kid expert.

bobgnote
12-09-2013, 04:20 PM
Just wait until they line up fraud on court!

They make known false reports, and the attorneys cheat discovery, including any defense attorneys and the court, and they continue, for hella money.

Then the whole zone borrows, from China.

What could be worse? The DDs let GW get with Mueller III, to suppress every existing FBI investigation, of bin Laden, al Qaida, and Saud, to make sure the 9/11 attacks happened, for the insider traders.

What could be worse? Afghanistan didn't have oil, but Iraq did, and it was ruled, by turned CIA asset, Saddam, who was part of a Sunni minority, ruling a Shiite majority (like in Bahrain, where is the 5th Fleet).

So, Kerry's 2003 subcommittee farted and fumed and let the GW gang off the hook. GW doinked Condi, but he didn't call a damn Senator, while his dink was in flagrante delicto.

Play on, piano-lady! What a land of the scam and home of the fee . . .

jillian
12-09-2013, 05:00 PM
known false reports???

scam?

kerry?

lawyers?

nice rant.

Cthulhu
12-09-2013, 05:24 PM
known false reports???

scam?

kerry?

lawyers?

nice rant.

I think he was responding to another tab in his browser and made a mistake - it happens.

The Xl
12-09-2013, 06:31 PM
Send them your phone number so the next time it happens they can call you in as their unruly kid expert.

If they need to call anyone about something so obvious, they probably have no business in that line of work.

Codename Section
12-09-2013, 06:47 PM
Send them your phone number so the next time it happens they can call you in as their unruly kid expert.

That's really an awesome response. Thumbs up.

As it happens I train people in this stuff, so maybe I will.

Max Rockatansky
12-09-2013, 08:41 PM
That's really an awesome response. Thumbs up.

As it happens I train people in this stuff, so maybe I will.

As it happens, I also have quite a bit of experience in training people along with behavior modification training. What do you train people to do? Age groups?

roadmaster
12-10-2013, 12:13 AM
They will put a parent in jail for what he did to the child. Even at my age I could have controlled the child without slapping him.

Max Rockatansky
12-10-2013, 08:13 AM
They will put a parent in jail for what he did to the child. Even at my age I could have controlled the child without slapping him.

It was a reaction under abnormal circumstances. Not many parents have to worry about being shot in the back while taking an unruly child to his father.

For his own protection, the kid should have been cuffed and held in place until the police car was driven to him rather that walking him 3 blocks screaming, biting and fighting all the way back.

shaarona
12-10-2013, 08:16 AM
@Codename Section (http://thepoliticalforums.com/member.php?u=866) I can't watch youtube at work, but if the kid was biting the officer did you expect the officer to keep letting himself get bit?

Why were the mother's friends egging the kid on? They should not have told the boy to run but encouraged him to settle down..

jillian
12-10-2013, 08:18 AM
Why were the mother's friends egging the kid on? They should not have told the boy to run but encouraged him to settle down..

again, haven't seen the video, shaarona.

shaarona
12-10-2013, 08:29 AM
again, haven't seen the video, shaarona.

Sorry.. I assumed you had.

The cop has the boy by the arm.. evidently he's a truant.. The mother's friends are out of camera range screaming at the cop and encouraging the boy to fight.

IMO its pretty shocking.. When this kid grows up they will all wonder how he was shot by police.

Max Rockatansky
12-10-2013, 08:33 AM
Sorry.. I assumed you had.

The cop has the boy by the arm.. evidently he's a truant.. The mother's friends are out of camera range screaming at the cop and encouraging the boy to fight.

IMO its pretty shocking.. When this kid grows up they will all wonder how he was shot by police.

Let's hope the boy's father can help the kid grow up to be something more than a street tough living in the park.

shaarona
12-10-2013, 08:37 AM
Let's hope the boy's father can help the kid grow up to be something more than a street tough living in the park.

I got the impression that there was no father..

"The rest of the video is fairly mundane, but I will note that the mother (Stephanie Johnston) lives in a bus and is proud that she hands out clean socks to people in the park. She also never sent her son to school and it is reported that he is illiterate. The videographer mentioned several times that her kids were taken away from her (gee, why does that not surprise me). Overall, the police exercised restraint with the crowd that gathered."

Max Rockatansky
12-10-2013, 09:00 AM
I got the impression that there was no father..

"The rest of the video is fairly mundane, but I will note that the mother (Stephanie Johnston) lives in a bus and is proud that she hands out clean socks to people in the park. She also never sent her son to school and it is reported that he is illiterate. The videographer mentioned several times that her kids were taken away from her (gee, why does that not surprise me). Overall, the police exercised restraint with the crowd that gathered."

The article in post #10 states the police were enforcing a child custody order to remove the child from his mother and place him in the custody of his father.

Cthulhu
12-10-2013, 09:11 AM
It was a reaction under abnormal circumstances. Not many parents have to worry about being shot in the back while taking an unruly child to his father.

For his own protection, the kid should have been cuffed and held in place until the police car was driven to him rather that walking him 3 blocks screaming, biting and fighting all the way back.

Totally agree - they have radios to call for assistance during difficult times.

roadmaster
12-10-2013, 02:51 PM
It was a reaction under abnormal circumstances. Not many parents have to worry about being shot in the back while taking an unruly child to his father.

For his own protection, the kid should have been cuffed and held in place until the police car was driven to him rather that walking him 3 blocks screaming, biting and fighting all the way back. He should have expected the child to react this way. We don't know the circumstances and anytime you take a child that doesn't want to go in which he could see this should have taken precautions. Hitting a child, scared not wanting to go and doing what he could is still wrong. He is not the boys dad.

Cthulhu
12-10-2013, 02:55 PM
He should have expected the child to react this way. We don't know the circumstances and anytime you take a child that doesn't want to go in which he could see this should have taken precautions. Hitting a child, scared not wanting to go and doing what he could is still wrong. He is not the boys dad.

A valid concern, but the mother pitching a fit didn't help the situation either, that will only rile up the child. But having your child taken from you is bound to stir some maternal instincts. Why there was only one officer doing the pick is utterly beyond me though. Domestic disputes are often the most dangerous for police to respond to.

roadmaster
12-10-2013, 03:19 PM
A valid concern, but the mother pitching a fit didn't help the situation either, that will only rile up the child. But having your child taken from you is bound to stir some maternal instincts. Why there was only one officer doing the pick is utterly beyond me though. Domestic disputes are often the most dangerous for police to respond to. Yes they are and should have been more police. We don't know if the ex was abusive or the mother. I have seen men get custody off of small things and they were very abusive during the marriage. I also know there are some crazy mothers out there. We can only hope he is going to the right parent.

Cthulhu
12-10-2013, 03:32 PM
Yes they are and should have been more police. We don't know if the ex was abusive or the mother. I have seen men get custody off of small things and they were very abusive during the marriage. I also know there are some crazy mothers out there. We can only hope he is going to the right parent.

All the above are well and good concerns. But largely beyond our ability to discern. Which is why I only focus on what I know verses what established patterns have been set by the background and the participants on stage.