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Chris
03-21-2014, 06:30 AM
The proposal is simple, create a forum area, call it "My Discussion," where members can start threads on any topic they would really like to discuss.

This "My Discussion" area will be defined by one rule:

The thread starter controls their own thread as to who and what remains in it.

If the thread starter decides for whatever reason to remove a member or a post, s/he simply PMs a moderator and the moderator removes no questions asked and no discussion necessary. A thread starter could also delegate this power. Removal is not because of a violation of rules and so should not count against you.

Moderators still moderate by existing rules as usual otherwise.

One purpose is this. Too often threads get derailed before they get going. It discourages some from starting threads. This would allow the thread starter to get the thread back on its rails. It doesn't guarantee a thread will take off, just that it won't go off topic. You may use the rule for your own purposes.

Does this give a member too much power? I don't think so. You can't force people to participate in your threads. If other think you are chasing people off unreasonably, like for mere disagreement, your threads would eventually be shunned.

Well, what do you think?

Captain Obvious
03-21-2014, 06:34 AM
Modding nightmare

Chris
03-21-2014, 06:37 AM
Modding nightmare

Why? They mod as usual. Only thing different is the thread starter can request removal of posters and posts.

Captain Obvious
03-21-2014, 06:42 AM
Right...

It will be abused, at the mods expense. People are children.

Captain Obvious
03-21-2014, 06:43 AM
Thats my .02, argue it with someone else.

Cigar
03-21-2014, 07:00 AM
Should be a nice comfortable place to chit-chat and have girl-talk. :laugh:

Chris
03-21-2014, 07:03 AM
Right...

It will be abused, at the mods expense. People are children.



Well, if you can't explain it, I can't argue it.

Captain Obvious
03-21-2014, 07:05 AM
Well, if you can't explain it, I can't argue it.

Thats good info to know.

Green Arrow
03-21-2014, 07:06 AM
I really like this idea. If the other mods feel it would be too much of a burden, I'd be happy to take it on myself. I think this proposal could really help in the way of creating and fostering more meaningful, "world class" discussions.

Chris
03-21-2014, 07:17 AM
I really like this idea. If the other mods feel it would be too much of a burden, I'd be happy to take it on myself. I think this proposal could really help in the way of creating and fostering more meaningful, "world class" discussions.


Not sure I understand the burden on mods. Say someone starts a thread under "My Discussion" and someone else disrupts it. The thread starter submits a request to remove poster and post and first mod to see it simply does it. There's no need for discussion among mods, it's not a rule violation and not a penalty.

Current policy calls for mod consensus to act in most cases and that can take effort to discuss and a long time depending on who's on line. And for mods there's no dealing with complaints from members for removal. All that's eliminated.


Like you, Green, I think this could have a positive effect for those who want more serious discussion without distraction.

Green Arrow
03-21-2014, 07:19 AM
Not sure I understand the burden on mods. Say someone starts a thread under "My Discussion" and someone else disrupts it. The thread starter submits a request to remove poster and post and first mod to see it simply does it. There's no need for discussion among mods, it's not a rule violation and not a penalty.

Current policy calls for mod consensus to act in most cases and that can take effort to discuss and a long time depending on who's on line. And for mods there's no dealing with complaints from members for removal. All that's eliminated.


Like you, Green, I think this could have a positive effect for those who want more serious discussion without distraction.

I don't think it would be burdensome at all, I'm just putting it out there in case it's brought up, as Captain did.

Captain Obvious
03-21-2014, 07:43 AM
Try it out, see if/how it works.

It could blow up also, people are vendetta babies and I'm guessing if it gets busy it's going to be a real pain in the ass for mods because not only will they have to do all the circuitry behind the scenes, they'll have to field all the whining when people start to be excluded.

Might happen, might not. I see potential for volatility here, just be careful.

Ravi
03-21-2014, 07:59 AM
Call it My Little Pony.

Captain Obvious
03-21-2014, 08:02 AM
Call it My Little Pony.

http://www.critic.co.nz/features/article/3365/the-mysterious-world--of-bronies

Ravi
03-21-2014, 08:05 AM
http://www.critic.co.nz/features/article/3365/the-mysterious-world--of-bronies
Damn.

Chris
03-21-2014, 08:06 AM
Try it out, see if/how it works.

It could blow up also, people are vendetta babies and I'm guessing if it gets busy it's going to be a real pain in the ass for mods because not only will they have to do all the circuitry behind the scenes, they'll have to field all the whining when people start to be excluded.

Might happen, might not. I see potential for volatility here, just be careful.


Meant to put something like that in the proposal. Some criteria to after a time judge whether it's worth it based on participation and pain in the ass factor. Or expand it if it's a success.

Chris
03-21-2014, 08:07 AM
Call it My Little Pony.

Feel free to request your own special little forum areas.

MrJimmyDale
03-21-2014, 08:50 AM
The idea sounds racist to me.........

Chris
03-21-2014, 09:01 AM
:grin:

Cthulhu
03-21-2014, 09:16 AM
This idea, and variants of it have been discussed at length in the VIP room, and likely moderator rooms as well. I support the idea. But getting it to happen is another matter entirely.

Mister D
03-21-2014, 09:40 AM
I see potential in the idea. Not sure what it entals on the back end. If that turns out to be a pain in the ass I'd say forget it.

Cigar
03-21-2014, 09:44 AM
Feel free to request your own special little forum areas.


Special is going away ... :grin:

Mister D
03-21-2014, 09:46 AM
^^^The reason for the proposal.

Cigar
03-21-2014, 09:49 AM
http://global3.memecdn.com/my-mom-says-i-amp-039-m-special_o_1509501.jpg

Captain Obvious
03-21-2014, 09:50 AM
^^^The reason for the proposal.

That part I totally get. Troll-free is appealing.

It could blow up though, if certain people start excluding other people, it could open a can of passive aggression from other members.

I dunno - I'd recommend trying it and not being afraid to pull the plug - especially if it turns into a nightmare to mod.

Mister D
03-21-2014, 09:58 AM
That part I totally get. Troll-free is appealing.

It could blow up though, if certain people start excluding other people, it could open a can of passive aggression from other members.

I dunno - I'd recommend trying it and not being afraid to pull the plug - especially if it turns into a nightmare to mod.

Yeah, that's a concern. We do have some babies here. I can see some tit for tat developing. I can also see why people get tried of the Cigar type crap littering what they want to be a serious discussion.

Chris
03-21-2014, 10:17 AM
Regarding potential tit-for-tat, say some member is a troll or trickster or joker or whatever, you just don't like him or his behavior, and you exclude him from your "My Discussion" threads. And in retaliation he excludes you from his. Well? Cool. :-)

It's not just exclusive. It could be inclusive. Say I want a discussion of anarchy among just anarchists, I could do that. Or if some else want just a discussion among Democrats, there you go. Just make it clear in OP you're under "My Discussion" and what you expect.



A comment on the racist comment, which was funny but "My Discussion" would not allow for that because over-the-top racism is moved to the Hole. IOW, standard rules and moderation still apply.

Captain Obvious
03-21-2014, 10:19 AM
I would exclude Cigar only because he's black.

... just for the record.

Codename Section
03-21-2014, 10:21 AM
As much as I hate thread derails, I also think Ethereal was right when he said there is not enough diversity of opinion here. These types of threads will end up becoming the conservative and anarchist havens, and be mini Trin's forum.

I guarantee Ravi and even Junie wouldn't block people from their threads. Cigar, either.

It will be (sorry) Kabuki Joe, you (Chris), and other conservatives on here--in my opinion using this feature. If I wanted to talk to conservatives all day I'd call home and speak to my father.

But yall do what you want.

Ravi
03-21-2014, 10:26 AM
Blocking people from threads is for wussies. Put them on ignore if you can't control yourself.

Captain Obvious
03-21-2014, 10:27 AM
Blocking people from threads is for wussies. Put them on ignore if you can't control yourself.

On one hand.

... on the other hand, members who are trying to have a serious discussion find it distracting when the thread is being bombarded by monkeys and trolls.

Codename Section
03-21-2014, 10:28 AM
On one hand.

... on the other hand, members who are trying to have a serious discussion find it distracting when the thread is being bombarded by monkeys and trolls.

And I agree with this, too.

I'm torn.

Ravi
03-21-2014, 10:28 AM
On one hand.

... on the other hand, members who are trying to have a serious discussion find it distracting when the thread is being bombarded by monkeys and trolls.
There is also the option to start an invite only group at this forum.

Which can be pretty comical all in itself.

Cigar
03-21-2014, 10:30 AM
Blocking people from threads is for wussies. Put them on ignore if you can't control yourself.

They're not feeling special, so they want to have their own little clubhouse ... just for the boys :laugh:

Sounds like a place for a lot of towel snapping Sandusky type stuff :grin:

Mister D
03-21-2014, 10:35 AM
I would exclude Cigar only because he's black.

... just for the record.

Ohhhh...that gives me some great ideas. White only threads!

6367

Chris
03-21-2014, 10:37 AM
As much as I hate thread derails, I also think Ethereal was right when he said there is not enough diversity of opinion here. These types of threads will end up becoming the conservative and anarchist havens, and be mini Trin's forum.

I guarantee Ravi and even Junie wouldn't block people from their threads. Cigar, either.

It will be (sorry) Kabuki Joe, you (Chris), and other conservatives on here--in my opinion using this feature. If I wanted to talk to conservatives all day I'd call home and speak to my father.

But yall do what you want.



I'd prefer to talk to liberals and progressives and socialists and anyone with different opinions and ideas--key word, discuss, without the distraction of nonsense.

Chris
03-21-2014, 10:41 AM
Let us recall, for those who've been here long enough to, that "On the Serious Side" was created for similar purposes. The main problem with it was it became a burden for mods to mod those who only sought to distract. There had to be discussion among mods, which took time. Then there was mods can only react if thread starter complains. It got to be such an annoying hassle we simply threw up our hands.

This removes all that and leaves it in the hands of the thread starter to decide, and the mods just act.

Mister D
03-21-2014, 10:42 AM
^^^ true My main concern in if it is a technical burden.

Chris
03-21-2014, 10:43 AM
There is also the option to start an invite only group at this forum.

Which can be pretty comical all in itself.



Not the same thing.

Ravi
03-21-2014, 10:43 AM
Let us recall, for those who've been here long enough to, that "On the Serious Side" was created for similar purposes. The main problem with it was it became a burden for mods to mod those who only sought to distract. There had to be discussion among mods, which took time. Then there was mods can only react if thread starter complains. It got to be such an annoying hassle we simply threw up our hands.

This removes all that and leaves it in the hands of the thread starter to decide, and the mods just act.
http://thepoliticalforums.com/group.php?do=create

Codename Section
03-21-2014, 10:50 AM
I'd prefer to talk to liberals and progressives and socialists and anyone with different opinions and ideas--key word, discuss, without the distraction of nonsense.

I agree. On principle we should have that option, but I think the results will end up destroying the forum. It will get petty quick.

Chris
03-21-2014, 10:53 AM
http://thepoliticalforums.com/group.php?do=create

Again, not the same thing.

Chris
03-21-2014, 10:54 AM
I agree. On principle we should have that option, but I think the results will end up destroying the forum. It will get petty quick.


Sorry, just not seeing how.

As explained in OP, someone who excludes for little reason will end up excluded himself.

Ravi
03-21-2014, 10:59 AM
Again, not the same thing.
Sure it is....it gives one an echo chamber that most posters won't bother to read.

But wait, perhaps you want your special forum showing up on What's New so you can lord it over those you boot out?

Comical.

Codename Section
03-21-2014, 11:00 AM
Sorry, just not seeing how.

As explained in OP, someone who excludes for little reason will end up excluded himself.

Exactly. It will get very petty quickly and end up destroying the forum.

Look, I'll be honest. I like Cigar as a dude. I'd take him out for beers and we'd have fun at a titty bar I'm sure, but I personally think his contributions to threads make zero sense and I feel like I lost time reading them.

BUT I would not exclude him because I'm not excluding his posts, I'd be excluding him. I think that's my chief concern and it's a moral one, as opposed to philosophical.

At the end of the day, we all "know" each other in the Internet sense and while I don't agree with Ravi on shit or Junie, I wouldn't actually want to hurt them for this world, as we say in the South.

Chris
03-21-2014, 11:01 AM
Sure it is....it gives one an echo chamber that most posters won't bother to read.

But wait, perhaps you want your special forum showing up on What's New so you can lord it over those you boot out?

Comical.


You don't understand what's being proposed. It's not the same thing.

Codename Section
03-21-2014, 11:05 AM
You don't understand what's being proposed. It's not the same thing.

If there was a way to delete posts that are off topic, I'd be with you. I just don't like the idea of deleting/excluding people.

Chris
03-21-2014, 11:06 AM
Exactly. It will get very petty quickly and end up destroying the forum.

Look, I'll be honest. I like Cigar as a dude. I'd take him out for beers and we'd have fun at a titty bar I'm sure, but I personally think his contributions to threads make zero sense and I feel like I lost time reading them.

BUT I would not exclude him because I'm not excluding his posts, I'd be excluding him. I think that's my chief concern and it's a moral one, as opposed to philosophical.

At the end of the day, we all "know" each other in the Internet sense and while I don't agree with Ravi on shit or Junie, I wouldn't actually want to hurt them for this world, as we say in the South.


Some of us* would like once in a while to have a serious discussion among people with a wide range of opinions and ideas but without petty distraction is my main purpose.

I don't want to exclude people, I'd prefer them to join in. But if they don't want to contribute, but only distract, then it's their problem. I give a damn those who behave like that exclude me in retaliation, we don't ever discuss anything together anyhow. They harm themselves.


*Apparently this has been discussed among VIPs and mods so there must be interest in something like it. It's come up many times in the past, was the reason for creating "On the Serious Side."

Broad interest like that indicates to me that rather than destroying the forum it might well build the forum into something better.

Chris
03-21-2014, 11:10 AM
If there was a way to delete posts that are off topic, I'd be with you. I just don't like the idea of deleting/excluding people.



Yet you do that now.


But, OK, I'd go along with that, on thread starter request remove posts, not posters.


But we know from past experience some will just distract again and again.

Ravi
03-21-2014, 11:59 AM
You don't understand what's being proposed. It's not the same thing.

JPP has it. It's seems ridiculous to me, especially when you can have your own private club.

Chris
03-21-2014, 12:11 PM
JPP has it. It's seems ridiculous to me, especially when you can have your own private club.


Sorry, ravi, but you make assumptions I don't share. Those assumptions throw you off on a tangent. I don't seek a private club. Just the opposite, a shared club of participants who contribute to discussion is all. Those who distract aren't interested in that.


Three differences between invite-only groups and this "My Discussion" proposal.

One, trivial, groups are groups, threads are threads.

Two, such groups are joined by invitation only. My proposal is for anyone to freely join discussion.

Three, groups are not included in "What's New?" Threads under "My Discussion" would be included.


Besides, it's all moot at this point for if you had been paying attention I agreed with Code to compromise my proposal and drop removing posters and only request removing posts.

Ravi
03-21-2014, 12:27 PM
You can do all that in a group aside from having it listed in new topics. So methinks you have an ulterior motive.

Why not just ask for another Trin like forum?

Chris
03-21-2014, 12:39 PM
You can do all that in a group aside from having it listed in new topics. So methinks you have an ulterior motive.

Why not just ask for another Trin like forum?



Sorry, ravi, but you make assumptions I don't share. Not the same thing at all. Go snark elsewhere, please.

Green Arrow
03-21-2014, 03:19 PM
If there was a way to delete posts that are off topic, I'd be with you. I just don't like the idea of deleting/excluding people.

If we were talking about the whole forum, I'd share your concerns, but we're not. We're just talking about one small portion, like The Hole. The rest of the forum would carry on as usual.

Chris
03-21-2014, 04:21 PM
If we were talking about the whole forum, I'd share your concerns, but we're not. We're just talking about one small portion, like The Hole. The rest of the forum would carry on as usual.



See http://thepoliticalforums.com/threads/23793-New-Forum-Area-Request?p=554460&viewfull=1#post554460 and http://thepoliticalforums.com/threads/23793-New-Forum-Area-Request?p=554465&viewfull=1#post554465
Green Arrow , I think code's good with just deleting posts on request, not posters, and I'm good with that.

And yes it would be just one forum area, not the whole forum.

Green Arrow
03-21-2014, 04:41 PM
See http://thepoliticalforums.com/threads/23793-New-Forum-Area-Request?p=554460&viewfull=1#post554460 and http://thepoliticalforums.com/threads/23793-New-Forum-Area-Request?p=554465&viewfull=1#post554465
Green Arrow , I think code's good with just deleting posts on request, not posters, and I'm good with that.

And yes it would be just one forum area, not the whole forum.

It seems to me like that would be more of a hassle than just removing the person. Particularly if it's an active thread and Cigar is posting in it.

Paperback Writer
03-21-2014, 04:42 PM
If we were talking about the whole forum, I'd share your concerns, but we're not. We're just talking about one small portion, like The Hole. The rest of the forum would carry on as usual.

But it wouldn't. The immaturity level here is such that it would become a playground for pettiness. As soon as this thread was started one of the posters here started a Little Pony group to make a point.

Green Arrow
03-21-2014, 04:44 PM
But it wouldn't. The immaturity level here is such that it would become a playground for pettiness. As soon as this thread was started one of the posters here started a Little Pony group to make a point.

Well, that one poster is one of our biggest offenders. Her attitude is not something to judge the rest of the forum on.

Chris
03-21-2014, 04:46 PM
It seems to me like that would be more of a hassle than just removing the person. Particularly if it's an active thread and Cigar is posting in it.

True, perhaps, though, start small and simple, and see where it goes.

Chris
03-21-2014, 04:49 PM
But it wouldn't. The immaturity level here is such that it would become a playground for pettiness. As soon as this thread was started one of the posters here started a Little Pony group to make a point.


But to what point?

Though I appreciate their subtitle.

Ravi
03-21-2014, 06:36 PM
But it wouldn't. The immaturity level here is such that it would become a playground for pettiness. As soon as this thread was started one of the posters here started a Little Pony group to make a point.

Would you like an invite?

Ravi
03-21-2014, 06:37 PM
Well, that one poster is one of our biggest offenders. Her attitude is not something to judge the rest of the forum on.

Wow. I offend you?

junie
03-21-2014, 06:58 PM
But it wouldn't. The immaturity level here is such that it would become a playground for pettiness. As soon as this thread was started one of the posters here started a Little Pony group to make a point.


lol was that immature do you think? so you say...

ravi wanted to test whether or not the function to remove posts was there so i made a post and she deleted it.

that's called proactive learning, but thanks for your repeated snark...

junie
03-21-2014, 07:01 PM
Wow. I offend you?


their 'bad attitude' is literally bleeding all over the board.

Paperback Writer
03-21-2014, 07:01 PM
lol was that immature do you think? so you say...

ravi wanted to test whether or not the function to remove posts was there so i made a post and she deleted it.

that's called proactive learning, but thanks for your repeated snark...

I am against this idea in case you hadn't realised. I think people intended to exclude you and you knew it, hence your Pony Party to make a point. This is how it would evolve. No insult to you, rather not a large insult.

Paperback Writer
03-21-2014, 07:02 PM
Would you like an invite?

Wot?

junie
03-21-2014, 07:03 PM
I am against this idea in case you hadn't realised. I think people intended to exclude you and you knew it, hence your Pony Party to make a point. This is how it would evolve. No insult to you, rather not a large insult.



you can act is if she did it to make a point of exclusion but you are wrong again.

Paperback Writer
03-21-2014, 07:07 PM
you can act is if she did it to make a point of exclusion but you are wrong again.

She was making the point and it was apt. These bits to exclude people from a thread, imo, are silly and divisive. It's making a value judgment on a person versus their commentary.

You ought to learn when someone is on your side in an argument and when they are not. Just because I'm not all chocolates and roses towards Ravi doesn't mean I don't place value on her ability to speak, or yours for that matter. I mention her because you seem quite on the defence when it comes to her.

Green Arrow
03-21-2014, 07:08 PM
Wow. I offend you?

Not hardly. I was using the word in the context of "one who does wrong," similar to how someone who breaks the law would be considered a "repeat offender."

junie
03-21-2014, 07:09 PM
i almost fell asleep before your second paragraph... true story.

Paperback Writer
03-21-2014, 07:09 PM
i almost fell asleep before your second paragraph... true story.

You do seem terribly old. It's to be expected. Now, I must go drink.

Tara, all!

Green Arrow
03-21-2014, 07:46 PM
You do seem terribly old. It's to be expected. Now, I must go drink.

Tara, all!

She strikes you as old? Hrm. I was thinking rather young, myself.

Chris
03-21-2014, 07:58 PM
She was making the point and it was apt. These bits to exclude people from a thread, imo, are silly and divisive. It's making a value judgment on a person versus their commentary.

You ought to learn when someone is on your side in an argument and when they are not. Just because I'm not all chocolates and roses towards Ravi doesn't mean I don't place value on her ability to speak, or yours for that matter. I mention her because you seem quite on the defence when it comes to her.


That intent was invented by others' paranoia. It was my intent to exclude distractions from discussion. I am fine with simply excluding posts.

Green Arrow
03-21-2014, 08:01 PM
This proposal has officially been presented to the V.I.P.'s for consideration.

MrJimmyDale
03-21-2014, 08:03 PM
Nay