Magic: The Gathering

[KC]

Anyone else play? I'm more or less done playing standard formats and have switched to Modern and Elder Dragon Highlander (EDH)/Commander. I only play the latter competitively.

[Peter1469]

I remember when it was a card game. Or maybe a board game. Or combo of the two.

[KC]

I remember when it was a card game. Or maybe a board game. Or combo of the two.

It's still a card game! That's the only proper way to play imo. Magic: Online is a failure by most accounts. Plus you miss the community when you play online. My college and local card stores both have really welcoming and friendly MTG communities.

[Green Arrow]

I've played a bit. Almost always as red/black.

[KC]

I've played a bit. Almost always as red/black.

I made a red/black pauper deck with a minotaur theme for fun. It actually functioned well, as long as I only played against other pauper decks. Red/black gives you a lot of control.

[IMPress Polly]

I played Magic for a few years, from the summer of 2000 until I graduated high school in 2003. I don't even remember it being an online game.

I first got into trading card games via the Pokemon explosion of 1999. (Who DOESN'T remember that??) I got into the Pokemon TCG for a couple years (summer 1999 to summer 2001 essentially), but soon found it to be extremely simple to the point of being boring. I mean seriously, all you had to do was build a Haymaker (a.k.a. high-speed, aggressive) deck packed with high-powered Basic Pokemon and tons of Trainer cards that let you rifle through your deck practically at will and you'd win 80% of the time at least. What was the point in the game even having Stage 1 and Stage 2 Pokemon?? The 30-something "pros" would build these more complicated combo decks seemingly just to be doing so even though they were easily defeated by simple, efficient Haymakers, half the time before they could even evolve the Pokemon required to make their combos and whatnot work! (Especially after Gym Challenge and Neo Genesis. I'm sorry, but cards like Sneasel, Rocket's Zapdos, Erika's Jigglypuff, Focus Band, Cleffa, and Gold Berry really gave Haymakers an epically unfair advantage.) It was, after all, a kid's game. Magic was more geared toward teenagers and adults.

So anyway, I discovered Magic and tabletop Dungeons & Dragons in 2000, after which the Pokemon TCG became more of a side hobby than a principal interest. D&D was fun, but my fascination with it was even shorter-lived than my Pokemon fascination. I kept on with Magic through the rest of my high school days though. I guess I do tend to have the same style across the board though, as I preferred straight Aggro decks in Magic too. :tongue: But hey, in Magic it was more like rock-paper-scissors in terms of what style of deck had an advantage over others.

[Peter1469]

I played Magic for a few years, from the summer of 2000 until I graduated high school in 2003. I don't even remember it being an online game.

I first got into trading card games via the Pokemon explosion of 1999. (Who DOESN'T remember that??) I got into the Pokemon TCG for a couple years (summer 1999 to summer 2001 essentially), but soon found it to be extremely simple to the point of being boring. I mean seriously, all you had to do was build a Haymaker (a.k.a. high-speed, aggressive) deck packed with high-powered Basic Pokemon and tons of Trainer cards that let you rifle through your deck practically at will and you'd win 80% of the time at least. What was the point in the game even having Evolution cards?? The 30-something "pros" would build these more complicated combo decks seemingly just to be doing so even though they were easily defeated by simple, efficient Haymakers, half the time before they could even evolve the Pokemon required to make their combos and whatnot work! (Especially after Gym Challenge and Neo Genesis. I'm sorry, but cards like Sneasel, Rocket's Zapdos, Erika's Jigglypuff, Focus Band, Cleffa, and Gold Berry really gave Haymakers an epically unfair advantage.) It was, after all, a kid's game. Magic was more geared toward teenagers and adults.

So anyway, I discovered Magic and tabletop Dungeons & Dragons in 2000, after which the Pokemon TCG became more of a side hobby than a principal interest. D&D was fun, but my fascination with it was even shorter-lived than my Pokemon fascination. I kept on with Magic through the rest of my high school days though. I guess I do tend to have the same style across the board though, as I preferred straight Aggro decks in Magic too. :tongue: But hey, in Magic it was more like rock-paper-scissors in terms of what style of deck had an advantage over others.

High school 2003?

:smiley:

I did AD&D old school. World of GreyHawk was my fav.

[Captain Obvious]

High school 2003?

:smiley:

I did AD&D old school. World of GreyHawk was my fav.

We were huge on Forgotten Realms. Had a whole wall bookcased with resources.

I was a big Myth Drannor campaigner.

[Peter1469]

We were huge on Forgotten Realms. Had a whole wall bookcased with resources.

I was a big Myth Drannor campaigner.Forgotten Realms was after my D&D time.

[Captain Obvious]

Forgotten Realms was after my D&D time.

We played up into like our mid 20's. Maybe even later.

[KC]

I played Magic for a few years, from the summer of 2000 until I graduated high school in 2003. I don't even remember it being an online game.

I first got into trading card games via the Pokemon explosion of 1999. (Who DOESN'T remember that??) I got into the Pokemon TCG for a couple years (summer 1999 to summer 2001 essentially), but soon found it to be extremely simple to the point of being boring. I mean seriously, all you had to do was build a Haymaker (a.k.a. high-speed, aggressive) deck packed with high-powered Basic Pokemon and tons of Trainer cards that let you rifle through your deck practically at will and you'd win 80% of the time at least. What was the point in the game even having Stage 1 and Stage 2 Pokemon?? The 30-something "pros" would build these more complicated combo decks seemingly just to be doing so even though they were easily defeated by simple, efficient Haymakers, half the time before they could even evolve the Pokemon required to make their combos and whatnot work! (Especially after Gym Challenge and Neo Genesis. I'm sorry, but cards like Sneasel, Rocket's Zapdos, Erika's Jigglypuff, Focus Band, Cleffa, and Gold Berry really gave Haymakers an epically unfair advantage.) It was, after all, a kid's game. Magic was more geared toward teenagers and adults.

So anyway, I discovered Magic and tabletop Dungeons & Dragons in 2000, after which the Pokemon TCG became more of a side hobby than a principal interest. D&D was fun, but my fascination with it was even shorter-lived than my Pokemon fascination. I kept on with Magic through the rest of my high school days though. I guess I do tend to have the same style across the board though, as I preferred straight Aggro decks in Magic too. :tongue: But hey, in Magic it was more like rock-paper-scissors in terms of what style of deck had an advantage over others.

I started playing agro, competitive standard decks that would place well in local tournaments, but that soon got expensive and boring. I now usually play creature based combo decks, which is why I prefer EDH (not sure when that started; it may have been popular while you were into MTG). Anyway , for me it's about coming up with a really creative build and testing it out against other players to see how well my ideas work. If I win some credit or some packs at the local card store, even better!

[IMPress Polly]

KC wrote:
I started playing agro, competitive standard decks that would place well in local tournaments, but that soon got expensive and boring. I now usually play creature based combo decks, which is why I prefer EDH (not sure when that started; it may have been popular while you were into MTG). Anyway , for me it's about coming up with a really creative build and testing it out against other players to see how well my ideas work. If I win some credit or some packs at the local card store, even better!

I'm not THAT old! :laugh: EDH is ancient, dating back almost as far as Magic itself. It had already been around for years by the time I got started.

You know, honestly I think the logical progression you describe yourself as undergoing is probably a natural one. I mean toward the end I too started finding myself spending more and more time in the EDH scene too. The general consensus was that EDH was for the more experienced, long-time players of the game with vast card collections. Eventually it got to a place where I started to feel kind of that way. The tournament scene was so cutthroat that it was hard to find occasion to make use of your Legendaries, for example! I mean you couldn't realistically build up armies! You have to use different rules for that to be very practical and EDH supplies them. What's more, in all honesty, the hyper-competitive nature of the tournament scene did get exhausting. The EDH scene was so much calmer and more community-oriented that I found spiritual value there that the tournament scene was missing. So I mean I certainly get what you're saying about the merits of the EDH scene.

Money was the basic reason I quit playing Magic. While I was still in high school with my parents footing the bills and sometimes even gifting me cards for special occasions it was one thing, but I found it unsustainable once I had to pay for everything myself. Well it wasn't actually unsustainable per se, but my new financial predicament forced me to choose between continuing on with Magic and continuing on with purchasing new video games on a regular basis. Something had to give. I had to give up one or the other of those things. I chose to give up Magic because video games had been my more established, longer-term hobby. Maybe if I had been playing Magic for a decade by that point it might have been different. Magic might've had more sentimental value to me by such a point. But I wasn't there yet.


Captain Obvious wrote:
We were huge on Forgotten Realms. Had a whole wall bookcased with resources.

Awesome! Forgotten Realms was my favorite D&D campaign setting! :smiley:


Peter wrote:
High school 2003?

:smiley:

Yup!


I did AD&D old school. World of GreyHawk was my fav.

I liked Greyhawk just fine as well. Forgotten Realms boasted a fantasy setting though that was just perfect for me!

Anyway, hmm...if Greyhawk was your favorite, Forgotten Realms (which dates from 1987) postdates your D&D days, and you're 44 now, then...I'm gonna say that means D&D was a high school hobby for you too, am I right?

[Cthulhu]

I've played a bit. Almost always as red/black.

Rat deck?

I have a only a few cards, but some grisly creatures in the green deck that I have. And a red deck that is tolerable. Wife usually pounds my guts out with the green deck though.

[Peter1469]

You are right. :smiley:



I liked Greyhawk just fine as well. Forgotten Realms boasted a fantasy setting though that was just perfect for me!

Anyway, hmm...if Greyhawk was your favorite, Forgotten Realms (which dates from 1987) postdates your D&D days, and you're 44 now, then...I'm gonna say that means D&D was a high school hobby for you too, am I right?

[KC]

I'm not THAT old! :laugh: EDH is ancient, dating back almost as far as Magic itself. It had already been around for years by the time I got started.

You know, honestly I think the logical progression you describe yourself as undergoing is probably a natural one. I mean toward the end I too started finding myself spending more and more time in the EDH scene too. The general consensus was that EDH was for the more experienced, long-time players of the game with vast card collections. Eventually it got to a place where I started to feel kind of that way. The tournament scene was so cutthroat that it was hard to find occasion to make use of your Legendaries, for example! I mean you couldn't realistically build up armies! You have to use different rules for that to be very practical and EDH supplies them. What's more, in all honesty, the hyper-competitive nature of the tournament scene did get exhausting. The EDH scene was so much calmer and more community-oriented that I found spiritual value there that the tournament scene was missing. So I mean I certainly get what you're saying about the merits of the EDH scene.

Money was the basic reason I quit playing Magic. While I was still in high school with my parents footing the bills and sometimes even gifting me cards for special occasions it was one thing, but I found it unsustainable once I had to pay for everything myself. Well it wasn't actually unsustainable per se, but my new financial predicament forced me to choose between continuing on with Magic and continuing on with purchasing new video games on a regular basis. Something had to give. I had to give up one or the other of those things. I chose to give up Magic because video games had been my more established, longer-term hobby. Maybe if I had been playing Magic for a decade by that point it might have been different. Magic might've had more sentimental value to me by such a point. But I wasn't there yet.

lol I didn't mean to call you old, but I honestly have no idea when EDH formats started seeing widespread play. I've been playing Magic for about three years now (I came in around Innistrad), so it's not something I've done for a long time but it's certainly something I've enjoyed since I started college and have had my own spending money.

I get the money thing, definitely. I've always said I'd probably play more video games if I wasn't so into Magic right now, but I prefer Magic of the two. I'm pretty good about having self control. Most of my Magic spending lately has been on EDH tournament entrance fees, and I've won in my pod enough times to get store credit for the singles I need for the several different deck builds I have. My favorite is easily the Bant colored flicker deck I've built (blue/white/green with a lot of enter the battlefield effects).

I stopped playing standard tournaments because, as you say, the competition is ridiculous. Everyone is playing a variant on the most powerful deck at the time, which is really lame (I've always preferred creativity over viability) and even when I was in standard I tried to play builds that no one else was doing just because I wanted to try something different.

[IMPress Polly]

KC wrote:
I stopped playing standard tournaments because, as you say, the competition is ridiculous. Everyone is playing a variant on the most powerful deck at the time, which is really lame (I've always preferred creativity over viability) and even when I was in standard I tried to play builds that no one else was doing just because I wanted to try something different.

Being a "form follows function" kind of person, I could never do that. I played to win. But I also reached a point where I wanted to stand a chance winning with a broader range of strategies and that was where I started to be drawn into EDH scene more and more. And like we keep saying, the less cutthroat atmosphere also just made it all more appealing.

[KC]

Being a "form follows function" kind of person, I could never do that. I played to win. But I also reached a point where I wanted to stand a chance winning with a broader range of strategies and that was where I started to be drawn into EDH scene more and more. And like we keep saying, the less cutthroat atmosphere also just made it all more appealing.

Do you have a preferred deck type? Most people I know have a favorite color or combination of colors.

[Mister D]

I liked the Goblin Deck. Mind you, I only briefly played and that was back in 1994 or 1995.

[KC]

I liked the Goblin Deck. Mind you, I only briefly played and that was back in 1994 or 1995.

I haven't seen anyone play a goblin deck recently, but the cards necessary to make a real viable goblin deck today are harder to come by. They used to be huge though.

[Mister D]

I haven't seen anyone play a goblin deck recently, but the cards necessary to make a real viable goblin deck today are harder to come by. They used to be huge though.

I only vaguely remember the game and its rules to be honest. My friend was really into it when he went to Rutgers. I thought it was fun. We used to play D&D together as teens so I was still sort of into fantasy. I do remember liking the Goblin deck though. Especially the fanatic card. Not sure if that was the actual name but it was a suicide goblin bomb.

[KC]

I only vaguely remember the game and its rules to be honest. My friend was really into it when he went to Rutgers. I thought it was fun. We used to play D&D together as teens so I was still sort of into fantasy. I do remember liking the Goblin deck though. Especially the fanatic card. Not sure if that was the actual name but it was a suicide goblin bomb.

I still haven't played D&D :/ I went to a friend's house and spent several hours making a character and that's as far as I got.

[Mister D]

I still haven't played D&D :/ I went to a friend's house and spent several hours making a character and that's as far as I got.

Ah, I honestly don't see why your generation would bother with the paper and pencil games. Or the tabletop games for that matter.

[KC]

Ah, I honestly don't see why your generation would bother with the paper and pencil games. Or the tabletop games for that matter.

They're fun! Video games are fun too, but there's little room for imagination.

[Peter1469]

I would imagine that computers with AD&D could make a great gaming environment without it being online. The computer could be the tool for the DM to tell the story line.

[Mister D]

They're fun! Video games are fun too, but there's little room for imagination.

That's a good point.

[Gerrard Winstanley]

I would imagine that computers with AD&D could make a great gaming environment without it being online. The computer could be the tool for the DM to tell the story line.
Would be a programming nightmare, but interesting nevertheless.

[Cthulhu]

I would imagine that computers with AD&D could make a great gaming environment without it being online. The computer could be the tool for the DM to tell the story line.

A lot of great open source software and servers have been set up for just that very thing too. Works pretty well. Once you get past the technical difficulties that is. You just need a voice medium, but google hangouts or skype works pretty well.

A couple examples:

http://roll20.net/
http://www.rptools.net/?page=maptool

Although it is much more organized to do a text only game as it is easier to keep track of who said/did what.

Tunning a Linux box with multiple workspaces make it a breeze.

[Captain Obvious]

I would imagine that computers with AD&D could make a great gaming environment without it being online. The computer could be the tool for the DM to tell the story line.

That's actually already being done with many RPG's, been that way for a while.

Neverwinter Nights has (or had) an online server where you could join campaigns. NWN also had a design toolset where you can create your own campaigns from scratch, graphics and all. Pretty nifty, I did my own a couple times and set it up on their server.

[Cthulhu]

That's actually already being done with many RPG's, been that way for a while.

Neverwinter Nights has (or had) an online server where you could join campaigns. NWN also had a design toolset where you can create your own campaigns from scratch, graphics and all. Pretty nifty, I did my own a couple times and set it up on their server.

They are still fairly limited though. "Can you kill the shop keeper?" is my main test for most creation engines.

Granted, the systems I listed aren't of any effect without a human being running things. But most strictly software RPG's have annoying limits on creativity.

[Captain Obvious]

They are still fairly limited though. "Can you kill the shop keeper?" is my main test for most creation engines.

Granted, the systems I listed aren't of any effect without a human being running things. But most strictly software RPG's have annoying limits on creativity.

I'm not an expert at game design but I completely understand your point.

I spent a fair amount of time working with the NWN tool set and it was flexible enough to assign "attitudes" not only to individual NPC's but classes and broader categories globally.

I set up this cool section in a hinterland camp where hunting was the primary source of food. Had an archer pace a predetermined walking path and a deer would spawn on rotation. He was programed to shoot the deer and continue on. Took me the longest time to design this stupid fucking scene but when I finally got it finished it was pretty cool.

Point - I had to make it so that when he shoots the deer all the animals on the campaign don't become hostile to him.

[Cthulhu]

I'm not an expert at game design but I completely understand your point.

I spent a fair amount of time working with the NWN tool set and it was flexible enough to assign "attitudes" not only to individual NPC's but classes and broader categories globally.

I set up this cool section in a hinterland camp where hunting was the primary source of food. Had an archer pace a predetermined walking path and a deer would spawn on rotation. He was programed to shoot the deer and continue on. Took me the longest time to design this stupid fucking scene but when I finally got it finished it was pretty cool.

Point - I had to make it so that when he shoots the deer all the animals on the campaign don't become hostile to him.

AI can be really cool, but making it is the opposite of fun, or cool.

A human being building/controlling the game world is the best IMO. Especially if they have that storyteller "ness".

[Captain Obvious]

AI can be really cool, but making it is the opposite of fun, or cool.

A human being building/controlling the game world is the best IMO. Especially if they have that storyteller "ness".

Agreed.

I did enjoy designing worlds even though nobody really played them.

My son did, he got a kick out of them.

[Private Pickle]

Played for a day...threw the cards away...

[IMPress Polly]

KC wrote:
Do you have a preferred deck type? Most people I know have a favorite color or combination of colors.

Generally speaking, blue and something. Most often blue and green. The closest I could come to mimicking the well-rounded, efficient Haymaker style of Pokemon deck I relied on for that game, built around a combination of fast and reliable power on the one hand and deck access and game manipulation on the other.

[KC]

Generally speaking, blue and something. Most often blue and green. The closest I could come to mimicking the well-rounded, efficient Haymaker style of Pokemon deck I relied on for that game, built around a combination of fast and reliable power on the one hand and deck access and game manipulation on the other.

Blue is a great color to splash and one which I think stands alone better than any other color in Magic. The control and card draw advantage blue gives you access to are fantastic. In fact, I'm building a blue/green deck around Edric right now (not an EDH; that would be too broken):

http://gatherer.wizards.com/Handlers/Image.ashx?multiverseid=230000&type=card

[IMPress Polly]

Mister D wrote:
Ah, I honestly don't see why your generation would bother with the paper and pencil games. Or the tabletop games for that matter.

Well I can't speak for others, but for me, much of my interest in games like the Pokemon TCG, Magic, and D&D came from an era that could be described as featuring a dearth of new, quality video game RPGs of the style I preferred. (Or at least a dearth of them making it to these shores anyway.) Magic in particular appeased my heartfelt need for strategic, turn-based combat with lots of options and fantastical themes! :grin:

[Cthulhu]

I still haven't played D&D :/ I went to a friend's house and spent several hours making a character and that's as far as I got.

I swear that is the worst part. @KC

[CreepyOldDude]

I would imagine that computers with AD&D could make a great gaming environment without it being online. The computer could be the tool for the DM to tell the story line.

I used to have a good program to do just that. It kept track of things like the weather, for outdoors, and I can't remember how much other stuff. It did a lot, though.

The program was written in BASIC, and was printed in Dragon magazine. I typed it into my Atari 800 computer, and tweaked it a bit.