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Peter1469
08-20-2015, 02:19 AM
What Iran can do with one nuclear weapon (http://www.washingtontimes.com/news/2015/aug/18/jams-woolsey-peter-pry-emp-a-shariah-approved-nucl/)

The conspiracy websites are all discussing the potential for Iran using a nuclear EMP attack against the US. The theory is sound and could be accomplished easily on the cheap once Iran has a nuclear weapon that is robust enough to be placed onto a missile, such as a SCUD.

http://twt-thumbs.washtimes.com/media/image/2015/08/18/8_182015_b1-wool-emp-graphic8201_c0-0-2933-1710_s561x327.jpg?f6491d7d626c13f9667fc152a25604e9 0455bd13

Congress must stop President Obama’s nuclear deal with Iran (http://www.washingtontimes.com/topics/iran/). The most important reason — Iran (http://www.washingtontimes.com/topics/iran/) can threaten the existence of the United States by making an electromagnetic pulse (EMP) attack using a single nuclear weapon.


A single nuclear weapon detonated at high altitude over the United States would generate an EMP that could black out the electric grid and other life-sustaining, critical infrastructures, such as communications, transportation, banking and finance, food and water. The Congressional EMP Commission (http://www.washingtontimes.com/topics/congressional-emp-commission/) estimated a nationwide blackout lasting one year could kill anywhere from two of every three Americans by a low estimate up to nine of 10 Americans by starvation and social disruption.

“Death to America” is more than merely an Iranian chant — Tehran’s military is planning to be able to make a nuclear EMP attack.


On July 21 at the annual meeting of the Electric Infrastructure Security Summit in Washington, Rep. Trent Franks quoted from an Iranian military textbook, recently translated by the Defense Intelligence Agency’s National Intelligence University. The textbook, ironically titled “Passive Defense” (2010), describes nuclear EMP effects in detail. It advocates in more than 20 passages an EMP attack to defeat decisively an adversary.

If the US was thrust into a pre-industrial age we would suffer up to 90% casualties within a year of the attack. Americans don't know how to live without modern infrastructure and conveniences.

For a novel that explores the topic, I suggest One Second After (http://www.amazon.com/One-Second-After-William-Forstchen/dp/0765356864).


New York Times best selling author William R. Forstchen now brings us a story which can be all too terrifyingly real...a story in which one man struggles to save his family and his small North Carolina town after America loses a war, in one second, a war that will send America back to the Dark Ages...A war based upon a weapon, an Electro Magnetic Pulse (EMP). A weapon that may already be in the hands of our enemies.

William
08-20-2015, 02:42 AM
What Iran can do with one nuclear weapon (http://www.washingtontimes.com/news/2015/aug/18/jams-woolsey-peter-pry-emp-a-shariah-approved-nucl/)

The conspiracy websites are all discussing the potential for Iran using a nuclear EMP attack against the US. The theory is sound and could be accomplished easily on the cheap once Iran has a nuclear weapon that is robust enough to be placed onto a missile, such as a SCUD.

http://twt-thumbs.washtimes.com/media/image/2015/08/18/8_182015_b1-wool-emp-graphic8201_c0-0-2933-1710_s561x327.jpg?f6491d7d626c13f9667fc152a25604e9 0455bd13




If the US was thrust into a pre-industrial age we would suffer up to 90% casualties within a year of the attack. Americans don't know how to live without modern infrastructure and conveniences.

For a novel that explores the topic, I suggest One Second After (http://www.amazon.com/One-Second-After-William-Forstchen/dp/0765356864).

Umm ... according to that graphic, the USA is less than 600 miles from coast to coast. Not according to what we learnt in geography class - the shortest distance coast to coast is 2,092 miles. So I'm not sure how much I would believe that Washington Times article. :smiley:

Peter1469
08-20-2015, 02:56 AM
Umm ... according to that graphic, the USA is less than 600 miles from coast to coast. Not according to what we learnt in geography class - the shortest distance coast to coast is 2,092 miles. So I'm not sure how much I would believe that Washington Times article. :smiley:

The figures in the graphic is not the width of the US. It is the altitude of the detonation of a nuclear bomb and the coverage of the EMP effects.

EMP is line of sight. The earth is a sphere. The lower the detonation, the less coverage of the EMP blast.

William
08-20-2015, 03:19 AM
The figures in the graphic is not the width of the US. It is the altitude of the detonation of a nuclear bomb and the coverage of the EMP effects.

EMP is line of sight. The earth is a sphere. The lower the detonation, the less coverage of the EMP blast.

So is the graphic showing the height of the detonation? But the earth's atmosphere ends at 300 miles, so how could an aircraft get a nuclear bomb that high - but I guess an ICBM could do it. :huh:

Peter1469
08-20-2015, 03:24 AM
So is the graphic showing the height of the detonation? But the earth's atmosphere ends at 300 miles, so how could an aircraft get a nuclear bomb that high - but I guess an ICBM could do it. :huh:

ICBM.

Scuds could get some of the height as well. A fishing vessel with a scud on it, covered with a tarp. Floating off shore. Remove the tarp. Set up the Scud. Fire the missile. Scuttle the boat. No trace. Who to blame?

Cthulhu
08-20-2015, 03:43 AM
Honestly, they wouldn't even need to get to the center of the states to cripple them.

If they just took out the eastern seaboard that would do the trick.

It would set off a chain reaction that would be unstoppable with regard to emergency relief aid, economic instability and supply shortage, not to mention the flood of refugees to the west which would simply not have either the supplies or the infrastructure to handle the refugees incoming.

Sinking titanic passengers ... Meet the life boat problem.

Enjoy.

Sent from my evil, baby seal-clubbing cellphone.

Common Sense
08-20-2015, 07:16 AM
Retarded graphic.

Plus someone's been reading WND.


But I am glad it's in the fantasy sci-fi section.

Peter1469
08-20-2015, 07:30 AM
Retarded graphic.

Plus someone's been reading WND.


But I am glad it's in the fantasy sci-fi section.

What do you think is wrong with it? It is very simple. Height of a nuclear explosion and coverage of the resulting EMP blast.

You don't like the height of the blast?

You don't like the coverage?

Perhaps the colors irritate you?

Have you ever read the Congressional EMP Commission (http://www.empcommission.org/reports.php)'s reports? Perhaps it will answer your questions. Everything mentioned above, other than the novel, is covered in the report.

Peter1469
08-20-2015, 07:35 AM
The author is

• R. James Woolsey is a former director of Central Intelligence and is chairman of the Foundation for Defense of Democracies. Peter Vincent Pry is executive director of the EMP Task Force on National and Homeland Security and served in the Congressional EMP Commission (http://www.washingtontimes.com/topics/congressional-emp-commission/), the House Armed Services Committee, and the CIA (http://www.washingtontimes.com/topics/united-states-central-intelligence-agency/).

Common Sense
08-20-2015, 07:59 AM
What do you think is wrong with it? It is very simple. Height of a nuclear explosion and coverage of the resulting EMP blast.

You don't like the height of the blast?

You don't like the coverage?

Perhaps the colors irritate you?

Have you ever read the Congressional EMP Commission (http://www.empcommission.org/reports.php)'s reports? Perhaps it will answer your questions. Everything mentioned above, other than the novel, is covered in the report.

It's the muted colors. ;)

gamewell45
08-20-2015, 08:04 AM
Hypothetically just one EMP device detonated over North America (depending on the size generated) would not only affect the United States, but Canada and Mexico as well in addition to parts of Russia. Devices that were not "hardened" or "shielded" from the effects of an EMP detonation would cease to operate instantly. Cars built after 1975 would stop working since they depend on computerized chips to work, computers, televisions, radios, stereo systems, power grids and most other electronic equipment would cease working. Aircraft would begin to crash since they are dependent on computers to fly and even people with pace makers would die since they would be effected as well. Make no bones about it, having an EMP device detonated over the United State would have world-wide consequences and that is why

I believe it's highly unlikely to ever occur; Europe and Russia would stand to take a financial hit as America's stock market collapsed and furthermore, (those of you in the military would likely know this) the United States has several classified weapon's systems designed to intercept and take out ICBM's and SCUD's. Ideally they work if put to the test.

Lets just hope we never have to see if it works or not.

Peter1469
08-20-2015, 09:35 AM
and furthermore, (those of you in the military would likely know this) the United States has several classified weapon's systems designed to intercept and take out ICBM's and SCUD's. Ideally they work if put to the test.

Lets just hope we never have to see if it works or not.

Consider this.

A fishing trawler flying a Panamanian flag appearing to fish of the US eastern seaboard. One the deck in something covered with a large tarp. At the right time, the tarp is removed, a Scud launcher is prepared and a Scud missile is launched high over the US. Perhaps another does the same in the Gulf of Mexico. The higher the detonation, the more land mass effected by the EMP pulse. After the attack the fishing vessels are scuttled.

Would our defenses catch this scenario? Would we ever find any evidence to link the EMP attack to its source? I expect we would not wait for evidence, but would immediately respond with a full scale nuclear attack on any nation that we think may have been involved. That would include Iran, North Korea, China, and Russia.

gamewell45
08-20-2015, 11:37 AM
Consider this.

A fishing trawler flying a Panamanian flag appearing to fish of the US eastern seaboard. One the deck in something covered with a large tarp. At the right time, the tarp is removed, a Scud launcher is prepared and a Scud missile is launched high over the US. Perhaps another does the same in the Gulf of Mexico. The higher the detonation, the more land mass effected by the EMP pulse. After the attack the fishing vessels are scuttled.

Would our defenses catch this scenario? Would we ever find any evidence to link the EMP attack to its source? I expect we would not wait for evidence, but would immediately respond with a full scale nuclear attack on any nation that we think may have been involved. That would include Iran, North Korea, China, and Russia.

You are absolutely correct; I think any scenario is possible and nothing is 100% guaranteed, but I'm confident that NSA satellites constantly monitor ships and any suspicious activity would have the US on alert and take out the offending trawler/ship if need be and accept the consequences later.

Russia and China know full well the ramifications of any involvement of even a limited nuclear exchange would have and the horrific damage that all countries would sustain in the event there was any suspicion of their involvement. As for North Korea and Iran, I still maintain that while they are crazy, they are not stupid and won't want to risk total nuclear incineration since they are so badly outmatched.

Either way I pray that this scenario never plays out since it could render the human species either a minor one or an extinct one.

southwest88
08-20-2015, 12:06 PM
ICBM.

Scuds could get some of the height as well. A fishing vessel with a scud on it, covered with a tarp. Floating off shore. Remove the tarp. Set up the Scud. Fire the missile. Scuttle the boat. No trace. Who to blame?

Scuds - @ least the mods that Iraq's Saddam Hussein did - were erratic in performance.

Anyway, back @ the main question - T. Clancy in Sum of all fears (I think it was) talked about nuclear forensics - see https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nuclear_forensics There's a fair body of info - mostly likely classified - but yah, even from just the explosion, you can collect a fair amount of data & develop that into information. From there you can track back to where the U (or plutonium, or what-have-you) came from, how it was processed, & so on. Ultimately, you want to be able to track the device to a particular country.

So, anyone looking to carry out one of these attacks will always have that question @ the back of his/her mind.

Cthulhu
08-20-2015, 02:20 PM
To be truthful, this potential EMP attack isn't going to be a missile attack from off shore.

It will likely be smuggled inside the states with relative easy via a shipping container or through one of the two ultra "secure" (lol) borders.

The rocket could be assembled inside the states without too much difficulty. No need for complex guidance or anything - just something to get altitude.

Sent from my evil, baby seal-clubbing cellphone.

Peter1469
08-20-2015, 02:22 PM
To be truthful, this potential EMP attack isn't going to be a missile attack from off shore.

It will likely be smuggled inside the states with relative easy via a shipping container or through one of the two ultra "secure" (lol) borders.

The rocket could be assembled inside the states without too much difficulty. No need for complex guidance or anything - just something to get altitude.

Sent from my evil, baby seal-clubbing cellphone.

Good point.

Peter1469
08-21-2015, 01:44 AM
An EMP can also be natural- caused by a solar storm. Scientists are worried about this possibility as well. (http://gizmodo.com/what-would-happen-if-a-massive-solar-storm-hit-the-eart-1724650105)


We all know that major storms can wreak havoc, flooding cities and decimating infrastructure. But there’s an even bigger worry than wind and rain: space weather. If a massive solar storm hit us, our technology would be wiped out. The entire planet could go dark.

“We’re much more reliant on technology these days that is vulnerable to space weather than we were in the past,” said Thomas Berger, director of the Space Weather Prediction Center (http://www.swpc.noaa.gov/) at the National Oceanic and Atmospheric Administration. He told Gizmodo, “If we were hit by an extreme event today, it’d be very difficult to respond.”


“Solar storm” is a generic term used to describe a bunch of stuff the Sun hurls our way, including x-rays, charged particles, and magnetized plasma. A massive solar storm hasn’t hit the Earth since the mid-19th century, but space weather scientists are very worried about the possibility of another.

Cthulhu
08-21-2015, 03:38 AM
An EMP can also be natural- caused by a solar storm. Scientists are worried about this possibility as well. (http://gizmodo.com/what-would-happen-if-a-massive-solar-storm-hit-the-eart-1724650105)
True that, if the sun has a mood swing, a bunch of people are going to die.

Sent from my evil, baby seal-clubbing cellphone.

AeonPax
08-21-2015, 04:43 AM
`
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There's a nifty little site for all you fantasy conspirators called "NUKEMAP (http://nuclearsecrecy.com/nukemap/)." It's an interactive simulation of detonating a nuclear bomb of your choice at different heights, anywhere in the US. It calculates damage and deaths.

Cthulhu
08-21-2015, 04:51 AM
`
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There's a nifty little site for all you fantasy conspirators called "NUKEMAP (http://nuclearsecrecy.com/nukemap/)." It's an interactive simulation of detonating a nuclear bomb of your choice at different heights, anywhere in the US. It calculates damage and deaths.
Does it allow for various payloads?

Sent from my evil, baby seal-clubbing cellphone.

AeonPax
08-21-2015, 05:00 AM
Does it allow for various payloads? Sent from my evil, baby seal-clubbing cellphone.
`
Yes. See #2 under "Yield (in kilotons)"

Cthulhu
08-27-2015, 02:16 AM
`
Yes. See #2 under "Yield (in kilotons)"
Ha! That's awesome.

If you weren't gay, and I weren't married, I could be perfectly comfortable putting you in the friend zone.

Sent from my evil, baby seal-clubbing cellphone.

Refugee
08-27-2015, 05:44 AM
What Iran can do with one nuclear weapon (http://www.washingtontimes.com/news/2015/aug/18/jams-woolsey-peter-pry-emp-a-shariah-approved-nucl/)

The conspiracy websites are all discussing the potential for Iran using a nuclear EMP attack against the US. The theory is sound and could be accomplished easily on the cheap once Iran has a nuclear weapon that is robust enough to be placed onto a missile, such as a SCUD.

http://twt-thumbs.washtimes.com/media/image/2015/08/18/8_182015_b1-wool-emp-graphic8201_c0-0-2933-1710_s561x327.jpg?f6491d7d626c13f9667fc152a25604e9 0455bd13




If the US was thrust into a pre-industrial age we would suffer up to 90% casualties within a year of the attack. Americans don't know how to live without modern infrastructure and conveniences.

For a novel that explores the topic, I suggest One Second After (http://www.amazon.com/One-Second-After-William-Forstchen/dp/0765356864).

I’m not in the ‘if’ camp, I’m in the ‘when’ one – Europe or America, but it will come. Iran and North Korea are busily engaged in nuclear production and there will be no lack of volunteers to do it and no one will know where it came from.
The west is now so dependent on advanced technology and at a social level, welfare, that any disruption will destroy it. I think many of the the current generation simply couldn’t handle life at its basic level.
In other words, if the power went off for one week in the west, the west would cease to function.

OGIS
08-30-2015, 04:02 PM
Make no bones about it, having an EMP device detonated over the United State would have world-wide consequences and that is why

I believe it's highly unlikely to ever occur; Europe and Russia would stand to take a financial hit as America's stock market collapsed and furthermore,...

Excellent points. Then consider the fallout from the economic consequences. For example: instantly, China's mighty industrial workforce is out of work. Welp! Nothing to do but put 'em all in the PLA and send them forth to smite whoever they think is responsible. And Iran and the rest of the Middle East (all likely suspects) are vulnerable to massed land invasion from the East. Which, of course, sucks in the Russians and Europe.

That's an interesting thought: the whole Eastern Hemisphere at war.... if the US stayed out of it?

Howey
08-30-2015, 04:15 PM
What Iran can do with one nuclear weapon (http://www.washingtontimes.com/news/2015/aug/18/jams-woolsey-peter-pry-emp-a-shariah-approved-nucl/)

The conspiracy websites are all discussing the potential for Iran using a nuclear EMP attack against the US. The theory is sound and could be accomplished easily on the cheap once Iran has a nuclear weapon that is robust enough to be placed onto a missile, such as a SCUD.

http://twt-thumbs.washtimes.com/media/image/2015/08/18/8_182015_b1-wool-emp-graphic8201_c0-0-2933-1710_s561x327.jpg?f6491d7d626c13f9667fc152a25604e9 0455bd13




If the US was thrust into a pre-industrial age we would suffer up to 90% casualties within a year of the attack. Americans don't know how to live without modern infrastructure and conveniences.

For a novel that explores the topic, I suggest One Second After (http://www.amazon.com/One-Second-After-William-Forstchen/dp/0765356864).

Thanks for finally admitting The Washington Times and The Heritage Foundation are conspiracy sites.

Peter1469
08-30-2015, 04:19 PM
Thanks for finally admitting The Washington Times and The Heritage Foundation are conspiracy sites.

They aren't conspiracy sites.