Does the left have a legitimate complaint about elections?

[TheLiquidGuy]

There is no faith in elections from Republicans these days. Join the club. Lefties have felt that way forever.

Is there voter fraud? Of course. 327 million people live here, so there must be some. You can come up with plenty of anecdotes. But even if you somehow assume 1,000,000 fraudulent votes are cast and even if you make the dubious assumption that all of those 1 million votes were cast to aid democrats, it would not amount to more than 1% of the vote. Therefore, no one has shown that voter fraud is significant enough to be anything other than an excuse to enact voter ID laws that aim to exclude minorities with "surgical precision" as in for example NC ( https://www.ca4.uscourts.gov/Opinion...d/161468.P.pdf ).

On the other hand, here are the reasons lefties don't trust elections. In my view Trump and future republicans cannot win illegitimately unless...

• there is no pivotal or significant voter ID laws that are likely intentionally discriminatory (for example, like the NC law that was struck down in 2017 and again in 2020),
• there is equally distributed and easy access to polling stations with working equipment and adequate staffing (I don't want to see 4 hour lines in the middle of nowhere for an urban district)
• there is no pivotal or significant gerrymandering,
• there is no pivotal or significant discarding of mail in ballots with underwhelming justification (such as failure to place in a privacy envelope),
• Trump wins because it is the TRUE WILL OF THE PEOPLE, not because he knew how to work the system, and not because he used his power to maintain power,

If all of these things could be true, I would begrudgingly accept elections as legit. I say "begrudgingly", because I still believe it is a travesty of justice that a president can win with a minority of votes, like in 2016.

If any insignificant or non-pivotal combination of these problems occur and amount to a significant difference, all bets are off too.

Of course who knows what other nutty crap this President will pull? For example, they have apparently been discussing having Republican governors override the vote and instead assign their own slate of electors in order to get Trump elected. So I reserve judgment for that, and similar shenanigans.

[Hoosier8]

Well civics is not a something the left learns. We are a constitutional republic not a simple majority democracy and there is a rational reason for that and the electoral college. In fact not winning by the popular vote but by the EC clearly outlines the rational behind the EC. Concentrated power in one state cannot overrule every other states vote.

[TheLiquidGuy]

Well civics is not a something the left learns. We are a constitutional republic not a simple majority democracy and there is a rational reason for that and the electoral college. In fact not winning by the popular vote but by the EC clearly outlines the rational behind the EC. Concentrated power in one state cannot overrule every other states vote.

Unfortunately I understand the stupidity of the EC.

It allows a minority of people in the country to be happy at the expense of a majority.



A majority of people in this country support medicare for all.
A majority of people in this country think the next justice should be nominated after the election.
A majority of people in this country support abortion rights
A majority of people in this country wanted Hillary


But we live in a minority rule country. It's a disgrace. It's an embarrassment. But you don't care. Because you are the minority.

[DGUtley]

Unfortunately I understand the stupidity of the EC.

It allows a minority of people in the country to be happy at the expense of a majority.



A majority of people in this country support medicare for all.
A majority of people in this country think the next justice should be nominated after the election.
A majority of people in this country support abortion rights
A majority of people in this country wanted Hillary


But we live in a minority rule country. It's a disgrace. It's an embarrassment. But you don't care. Because you are the minority.

For you to say those things, then, you don't understand the Electoral College.

[Peter1469]

For you to say those things, then, you don't understand the Electoral College.

Good response. Glad I scrolled down before I corrected him.

[Hoosier8]

Unfortunately I understand the stupidity of the EC.

It allows a minority of people in the country to be happy at the expense of a majority.



A majority of people in this country support medicare for all.
A majority of people in this country think the next justice should be nominated after the election.
A majority of people in this country support abortion rights
A majority of people in this country wanted Hillary


But we live in a minority rule country. It's a disgrace. It's an embarrassment. But you don't care. Because you are the minority.

Sorry, but uneducated opinion does not trump the brilliance of the Constitution.

[Perianne]

Let's say a majority of people want LiquidGuy executed. Should the majority get what they want? Of course not.

[TheLiquidGuy]

For you to say those things, then, you don't understand the Electoral College.

I am speaking about a larger issue here and you look for a technicality to criticize. I am not just talking about the EC. I am talking about the will of the majority being sidelined either systemically or by working the system. If you believe in democracy, you should be appalled by how perverse it has become here. If you dont believe in democracy, then you are unamerican and unprincipled despite claiming to be.

[TheLiquidGuy]

Let's say a majority of people want LiquidGuy executed. Should the majority get what they want? Of course not.

lol

I would honestly be far more bitter about it if let's say a minority of people wanted me executed.

I am aware the majority can be tyrannical. But majority rule is the centerpiece of democracy and the usa doesn't abide that.

[DGUtley]

I am speaking about a larger issue here and you look for a technicality to criticize. I am not just talking about the EC. I am talking about the will of the majority being sidelined either systemically or by working the system. If you believe in democracy, you should be appalled by how perverse it has become here. If you dont believe in democracy, then you are unamerican and unprincipled despite claiming to be.

I am neither un-American nor do I lack principles. I understand the brilliance of the constitution as developed and drafted by the founders, including the electoral college. I love the United States Constitution.