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Thread: Most Muslim Americans See No Justification for Attacking Civilians

  1. #21
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    Quote Originally Posted by DGUtley View Post
    You aren't talking about religious attitudes, you are talking about how people of certain religions feel about the military and violence against civilians. The past 10 years has had a tremendous amount of violence committed by religious extremists. I suspect the answers may have changed a bit. I could be wrong.
    I will try to find more recent poll data.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Calypso Jones View Post
    Democrats target civilians.
    Old Democrats were racists and nationalists -- thus they President Harry S. Truman in office from 1945 to 1953 was an Old Democrat.

    New Democrats are Leftist but still Totalitarian.

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    Quote Originally Posted by CCitizen View Post
    Definitely, guerilla fighters are not civilian.
    Under current international law they may be. The laws of land warfare recognize only two types of people. Combatants- these must meet certain criteria.

    Everyone else is a civilian. So a civilian can take up arms and not meet the criteria to be a combatant.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Cletus View Post
    Most people don't favor targeting civilians, but most people don't understand war.

    As I said in another thread, wars are not fought between armies. They are fought between nations. Armies cannot wage war without civilian support. Wars are won by doing two things... destroying the enemy's ability to fight and more importantly, by destroying his WILL to fight. You break his will by threatening what he holds most precious. We didn't win WWII by crushing the Wehrmacht and the Japanese Imperial forces. We did it by destroying their cities, their means of production, and their will to fight.

    We haven't won a war in long time because somewhere along the line, we forgot how to fight one. We got away from the "total war" concept and started engaging in "limited" war. We stopped targeting civilians and civilian infrastructure. That hasn't worked and it never will.
    I agree with the first two paragraphs.

    So far as limited war goes it has its place. Especially for a super power. We fight limited wars to achieve limited ends. Victory over the other side doesn't have to be an end.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Peter1469 View Post
    I agree with the first two paragraphs.

    So far as limited war goes it has its place. Especially for a super power. We fight limited wars to achieve limited ends. Victory over the other side doesn't have to be an end.
    That is why we have wars that last forever. We don't fight to win.

    The troops on the ground do their part. They always have and always will, but the political leadership prevents the taking of measures that are necessary to break the will of the enemy. Because of that, we now engage in campaigns that last for decades.

    Regarding the use of military force against a hostile state, we need to either go all in or stay home.
    “Extremism in defense of liberty is no vice. Moderation in pursuit of justice is no virtue.” - Barry Goldwater

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    Quote Originally Posted by Cletus View Post
    That is why we have wars that last forever. We don't fight to win.

    The troops on the ground do their part. They always have and always will, but the political leadership prevents the taking of measures that are necessary to break the will of the enemy. Because of that, we now engage in campaigns that last for decades.

    Regarding the use of military force against a hostile state, we need to either go all in or stay home.
    The only reason the war in Afghanistan has gone on forever is because we shifted to nation building. I am certainly against that.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Peter1469 View Post
    Under current international law they may be. The laws of land warfare recognize only two types of people. Combatants- these must meet certain criteria.

    Everyone else is a civilian. So a civilian can take up arms and not meet the criteria to be a combatant.
    Sadly I am ignorant of most International Law.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Cletus View Post
    That is why we have wars that last forever. We don't fight to win.
    During wars in Philippines, Japan Bombing 1945, Korea 1950-53, US strategy was almost genocidal.

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    Quote Originally Posted by CCitizen View Post
    During wars in Philippines, Japan Bombing 1945, Korea 1950-53, US strategy was almost genocidal.
    The world has turned a few times since then, now we have laser guided, pinpoint accurate bombs, bunker busters, MOAB, drones capable of taking out multiple moving objects, surveillance and striking ability that quite simply is state of the art.
    Mass genocide that happened back then will never be repeated.
    RIP Wes

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