User Tag List

+ Reply to Thread
Page 1 of 3 123 LastLast
Results 1 to 10 of 25

Thread: Biden’s Stimulus Plans will Create Unacceptable Debt

  1. #1
    Original Ranter
    Points: 859,122, Level: 100
    Level completed: 0%, Points required for next Level: 0
    Overall activity: 90.0%
    Achievements:
    SocialCreated Album picturesOverdrive50000 Experience PointsVeteran
    Awards:
    Posting Award
    Peter1469's Avatar Advisor
    Karma
    496582
    Join Date
    Jun 2011
    Location
    NOVA
    Posts
    241,700
    Points
    859,122
    Level
    100
    Thanks Given
    153,223
    Thanked 147,592x in 94,421 Posts
    Mentioned
    2552 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)

    Biden’s Stimulus Plans will Create Unacceptable Debt

    This article uses last year's COVID spending to show that the Joe* plan is going to add too much debt while obtaining little to no economic benefits. IMO, the only effective way to improve the economy is to end the lockdowns.



    Biden’s Stimulus Plans will Create Unacceptable Debt


    President-elect Biden has made no secret of the fact that, once in office, he is ready and willing to support a lot of new spending. Last week, he made good on his pledge, unveiling a $1.9 trillion “relief” package less than a month after Congress had passed a nearly $1 trillion pandemic-related stimulus measure.



    In a speech announcing the details of the new package, billed as the American Rescue Plan, Biden noted that it will include $400 a week in extended unemployment insurance, $1,400 “stimulus” checks for all but high wage earners, a $15 federally-mandated minimum wage, 14 weeks of paid family and medical leave, and rent forbearance—to list just a few.
    Before we assess the reasons why adding trillions of dollars more debt to an already huge mountain of debt is wrong, we should be mindful of just how much the government has already spent on “relief/stimulus” measures over the past 10 months. Tallying up the Families First Act, the CARES Act, Paycheck Protection Program loans, and the Response and Relief Act, the federal government has allocated about $4.5 trillion, of which $3.42 trillion will be entirely deficit-financed.






    This is the part about the lack of economic benefit. Recall that the return on investment of the Apollo Program was ~26:1 (largely due to the numerous civilian applications of the tech developed for the program) while the ROI for welfare payments is ~0.67:1.

    The Myth of the Spending Multiplier


    And for what? The calls for sustained spending during a recession—in the form of unemployment checks, individual stimulus checks, small-business grants, shovel-ready projects and payroll tax cuts—rest on the idea of an all-powerful federal spending multiplier, or the idea that if the government spends one dollar, the economy will grow by more than a dollar. This argument ignores recent empirical evidence that the costs of increased government spending far outweigh the benefits to the economy.

    For starters, contrary to the claims of government spending proponents, economists have not reached a consensus about the actual return on government spending. While some economists find that a dollar spent by the government generates more than a dollar in return, others find that the return is less than one dollar. And yet others find that if you take into account the future taxes needed to pay for the dollar that’s spent and the resulting loss of capital for use in the private economy, the multiplier is actually negative, and the economy takes a hit.

    Our recent review of the academic literature reveals that most of “the empirical literature on fiscal multipliers conducted since [2009] has found economic multipliers resulting from additional government spending ranging from a lower estimate of around 0.2 to an upper estimate of around 0.9.” We go on to explain that in “pulling the results from two dozen academic studies, we calculate an average multiplier at the low end of 0.31 and an average multiplier at the high end of 0.66.”

    There are rare cases when government spending can stimulate the economy. But for that to happen, the environment in which the spending takes place, such as a situation involving sizable indebtedness, and the design and speed of the stimulus are important in its success. Unfortunately, the United States has the features of a country where stimulus by spending has little if any impact and, in fact, can have a negative impact on growth.

    As so it was with the CARES Act. According to the Congressional Budget Office (CBO), the long-term cumulative growth resulting from each dollar of spending under the legislation was 58 cents. Not very stimulative. There is no reason to believe that the next round of spending, and the one after that, will be any different.
    Last edited by Peter1469; 01-21-2021 at 04:09 AM.
    ΜOΛΩΝ ΛΑΒΕ


  2. The Following 2 Users Say Thank You to Peter1469 For This Useful Post:

    Cotton1 (01-21-2021),MMC (01-21-2021)

  3. #2
    Original Ranter
    Points: 859,122, Level: 100
    Level completed: 0%, Points required for next Level: 0
    Overall activity: 90.0%
    Achievements:
    SocialCreated Album picturesOverdrive50000 Experience PointsVeteran
    Awards:
    Posting Award
    Peter1469's Avatar Advisor
    Karma
    496582
    Join Date
    Jun 2011
    Location
    NOVA
    Posts
    241,700
    Points
    859,122
    Level
    100
    Thanks Given
    153,223
    Thanked 147,592x in 94,421 Posts
    Mentioned
    2552 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)
    The article goes on to explain why the debt matters- interest rates won't stay low forever. When they rise back to their historic average of 4-5% the interest payments allow will eat up most of the discretionary budget.

    Then the federal government won't be spending much on anything else. Those addicted to federal programs will be in a world of hurt.

    And Joe's* minimum wage hike will put upward pressure on the inflation rate.
    ΜOΛΩΝ ΛΑΒΕ


  4. The Following 2 Users Say Thank You to Peter1469 For This Useful Post:

    Collateral Damage (01-21-2021),Cotton1 (01-21-2021)

  5. #3
    Points: 119,206, Level: 83
    Level completed: 86%, Points required for next Level: 444
    Overall activity: 59.0%
    Achievements:
    SocialCreated Album pictures50000 Experience PointsOverdriveVeteran
    Cotton1's Avatar Senior Member
    Karma
    24504
    Join Date
    Dec 2018
    Location
    Mid-South
    Posts
    33,229
    Points
    119,206
    Level
    83
    Thanks Given
    27,224
    Thanked 24,513x in 16,037 Posts
    Mentioned
    146 Post(s)
    Tagged
    1 Thread(s)
    Quote Originally Posted by Peter1469 View Post
    The article goes on to explain why the debt matters- interest rates won't stay low forever. When they rise back to their historic average of 4-5% the interest payments allow will eat up most of the discretionary budget.

    Then the federal government won't be spending much on anything else. Those addicted to federal programs will be in a world of hurt.

    And Joe's* minimum wage hike will put upward pressure on the inflation rate.
    That's a good point about his minimum wage and inflation. It will not bode well for growth either.

    Once you get into an environment of low to no growth with inflation you then have " stagflation" which is the worst economic evil of all
    I'm yo.
    This my brother yo
    We yo yo

  6. The Following 4 Users Say Thank You to Cotton1 For This Useful Post:

    Abby08 (01-21-2021),Collateral Damage (01-21-2021),Peter1469 (01-21-2021),stjames1_53 (01-21-2021)

  7. #4
    Original Ranter
    Points: 859,122, Level: 100
    Level completed: 0%, Points required for next Level: 0
    Overall activity: 90.0%
    Achievements:
    SocialCreated Album picturesOverdrive50000 Experience PointsVeteran
    Awards:
    Posting Award
    Peter1469's Avatar Advisor
    Karma
    496582
    Join Date
    Jun 2011
    Location
    NOVA
    Posts
    241,700
    Points
    859,122
    Level
    100
    Thanks Given
    153,223
    Thanked 147,592x in 94,421 Posts
    Mentioned
    2552 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)
    Quote Originally Posted by Cotton1 View Post
    That's a good point about his minimum wage and inflation. It will not bode well for growth either.

    Once you get into an environment of low to no growth with inflation you then have " stagflation" which is the worst economic evil of all
    Joe* the dummy is stepping right into it.
    ΜOΛΩΝ ΛΑΒΕ


  8. The Following 2 Users Say Thank You to Peter1469 For This Useful Post:

    Abby08 (01-21-2021),Cotton1 (01-21-2021)

  9. #5
    Points: 119,206, Level: 83
    Level completed: 86%, Points required for next Level: 444
    Overall activity: 59.0%
    Achievements:
    SocialCreated Album pictures50000 Experience PointsOverdriveVeteran
    Cotton1's Avatar Senior Member
    Karma
    24504
    Join Date
    Dec 2018
    Location
    Mid-South
    Posts
    33,229
    Points
    119,206
    Level
    83
    Thanks Given
    27,224
    Thanked 24,513x in 16,037 Posts
    Mentioned
    146 Post(s)
    Tagged
    1 Thread(s)
    Quote Originally Posted by Peter1469 View Post
    Joe* the dummy is stepping right into it.
    We had a good round of stagflation in the Carter era. Those two remind me of one another
    I'm yo.
    This my brother yo
    We yo yo

  10. #6
    Original Ranter
    Points: 859,122, Level: 100
    Level completed: 0%, Points required for next Level: 0
    Overall activity: 90.0%
    Achievements:
    SocialCreated Album picturesOverdrive50000 Experience PointsVeteran
    Awards:
    Posting Award
    Peter1469's Avatar Advisor
    Karma
    496582
    Join Date
    Jun 2011
    Location
    NOVA
    Posts
    241,700
    Points
    859,122
    Level
    100
    Thanks Given
    153,223
    Thanked 147,592x in 94,421 Posts
    Mentioned
    2552 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)
    Quote Originally Posted by Cotton1 View Post
    We had a good round of stagflation in the Carter era. Those two remind me of one another
    I don't. Carter was naive, but he was a good person.
    ΜOΛΩΝ ΛΑΒΕ


  11. The Following 3 Users Say Thank You to Peter1469 For This Useful Post:

    Collateral Damage (01-21-2021),Cotton1 (01-21-2021),countryboy (01-21-2021)

  12. #7
    Points: 119,206, Level: 83
    Level completed: 86%, Points required for next Level: 444
    Overall activity: 59.0%
    Achievements:
    SocialCreated Album pictures50000 Experience PointsOverdriveVeteran
    Cotton1's Avatar Senior Member
    Karma
    24504
    Join Date
    Dec 2018
    Location
    Mid-South
    Posts
    33,229
    Points
    119,206
    Level
    83
    Thanks Given
    27,224
    Thanked 24,513x in 16,037 Posts
    Mentioned
    146 Post(s)
    Tagged
    1 Thread(s)
    Quote Originally Posted by Peter1469 View Post
    I don't. Carter was naive, but he was a good person.
    True
    I'm yo.
    This my brother yo
    We yo yo

  13. #8
    Original Ranter
    Points: 388,252, Level: 100
    Level completed: 0%, Points required for next Level: 0
    Overall activity: 0.2%
    Achievements:
    SocialRecommendation Second ClassOverdriveTagger First Class50000 Experience PointsVeteran
    MMC's Avatar Senior Member
    Karma
    70166
    Join Date
    Jun 2011
    Location
    Chicago Illinois
    Posts
    89,892
    Points
    388,252
    Level
    100
    Thanks Given
    54,131
    Thanked 39,163x in 27,727 Posts
    Mentioned
    243 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)
    Cmon now.....the Lame Stream media is already giving us the clue. It will be blamed on Trump for what JoJo inherited.
    History does not long Entrust the care of Freedom, to the Weak or Timid!!!!! Dwight D. Eisenhower ~

  14. #9
    Original Ranter
    Points: 859,122, Level: 100
    Level completed: 0%, Points required for next Level: 0
    Overall activity: 90.0%
    Achievements:
    SocialCreated Album picturesOverdrive50000 Experience PointsVeteran
    Awards:
    Posting Award
    Peter1469's Avatar Advisor
    Karma
    496582
    Join Date
    Jun 2011
    Location
    NOVA
    Posts
    241,700
    Points
    859,122
    Level
    100
    Thanks Given
    153,223
    Thanked 147,592x in 94,421 Posts
    Mentioned
    2552 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)
    Quote Originally Posted by MMC View Post
    Cmon now.....the Lame Stream media is already giving us the clue. It will be blamed on Trump for what JoJo inherited.
    We won't let them get away with that.
    ΜOΛΩΝ ΛΑΒΕ


  15. #10
    Points: 138,419, Level: 89
    Level completed: 70%, Points required for next Level: 1,031
    Overall activity: 36.0%
    Achievements:
    Tagger First ClassSocial50000 Experience PointsVeteran
    stjames1_53's Avatar Senior Member
    Karma
    58249
    Join Date
    Apr 2016
    Posts
    50,630
    Points
    138,419
    Level
    89
    Thanks Given
    104,299
    Thanked 29,270x in 20,298 Posts
    Mentioned
    175 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)
    Quote Originally Posted by Peter1469 View Post
    Joe* the dummy is stepping right into it.
    I wonder if he's not being pushed into it by the DNC handlers...............
    For waltky: http://quakes.globalincidentmap.com/
    "The Nation that makes a great distinction between its scholars and its warriors will have its thinking done by cowards and its fighting done by fools."
    - Thucydides

    "Democracy is two wolves and a lamb voting on what to have for lunch. Liberty is a well-armed lamb contesting the vote" B. Franklin
    Igitur qui desiderat pacem, praeparet bellum

+ Reply to Thread

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts