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Thread: 'Is God A Liberal?'

  1. #21
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    midcan5's Avatar Senior Member
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    More childish, no, you are.... Mister D can't answer a previous question of mine so he whines on. Sad.


    On topic:


    "But such inner spirituality cannot be imposed from without. It must be chosen. The freedom to choose one's spirituality is a precondition to the genuine adoption of any spirituality. Such freedom, also, is precisely what is held sacrosanct in the political philosophy of liberalism. By not imposing a specific spirituality, thus, liberalism makes genuine spirituality possible. It is significant to note that when the Declaration of Independence declares all men have been endowed by their creator with certain inalienable rights, it is not simply stating an arbitrary preference for those rights, it is making a metaphysical claim. Freedom of choice is not first of all a political 'right' granted by the state; it is first of all an ontological fact. Human beings are endowed with the freedom to choose as part of their essential nature, whether or not political institutions respect this freedom. Liberalism does not create freedom, it merely protects it. From a theistic perspective, then, freedom of choice must be seen as God's creation, and liberalism, the political philosophy dedicated to its preservation, as honoring the will of God."


    So do those who read agree?
    Wanna make America great, buy American owned, made in the USA, we do. AF Veteran, INFJ-A, I am not PC.

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  2. #22
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    Progressives are illiberal.

    What the US called conservative and liberal are both liberal in the Western civilization sense of the term.

    But Trump made you insane so you wouldn't know that.

    Quote Originally Posted by midcan5 View Post
    More childish, no, you are.... Mister D can't answer a previous question of mine so he whines on. Sad.


    On topic:


    "But such inner spirituality cannot be imposed from without. It must be chosen. The freedom to choose one's spirituality is a precondition to the genuine adoption of any spirituality. Such freedom, also, is precisely what is held sacrosanct in the political philosophy of liberalism. By not imposing a specific spirituality, thus, liberalism makes genuine spirituality possible. It is significant to note that when the Declaration of Independence declares all men have been endowed by their creator with certain inalienable rights, it is not simply stating an arbitrary preference for those rights, it is making a metaphysical claim. Freedom of choice is not first of all a political 'right' granted by the state; it is first of all an ontological fact. Human beings are endowed with the freedom to choose as part of their essential nature, whether or not political institutions respect this freedom. Liberalism does not create freedom, it merely protects it. From a theistic perspective, then, freedom of choice must be seen as God's creation, and liberalism, the political philosophy dedicated to its preservation, as honoring the will of God."


    So do those who read agree?
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  3. #23
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    hanger4's Avatar Advisor
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    Quote Originally Posted by Standing Wolf View Post
    This thread so far has been a real showpiece - a demonstration of how to avoid an honest and forthright discussion by insults, deflection and bad faith posting. Bra-f'ing-vo.
    Midcan5 hasn't honestly or forthrightly discussed anything, midcan5 doesn't address posters that quote him, so address your castigation in the proper direction.

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  5. #24
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    Quote Originally Posted by midcan5 View Post
    More childish, no, you are.... Mister D can't answer a previous question of mine so he whines on. Sad.


    On topic:


    "But such inner spirituality cannot be imposed from without. It must be chosen. The freedom to choose one's spirituality is a precondition to the genuine adoption of any spirituality. Such freedom, also, is precisely what is held sacrosanct in the political philosophy of liberalism. By not imposing a specific spirituality, thus, liberalism makes genuine spirituality possible. It is significant to note that when the Declaration of Independence declares all men have been endowed by their creator with certain inalienable rights, it is not simply stating an arbitrary preference for those rights, it is making a metaphysical claim. Freedom of choice is not first of all a political 'right' granted by the state; it is first of all an ontological fact. Human beings are endowed with the freedom to choose as part of their essential nature, whether or not political institutions respect this freedom. Liberalism does not create freedom, it merely protects it. From a theistic perspective, then, freedom of choice must be seen as God's creation, and liberalism, the political philosophy dedicated to its preservation, as honoring the will of God."


    So do those who read agree?
    It would probably behove you understand the meanings of 'progressive' and 'classical liberal'. You actually understand what you're reading.

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    Quote Originally Posted by midcan5 View Post
    More childish, no, you are.... Mister D can't answer a previous question of mine so he whines on. Sad.


    On topic:


    "But such inner spirituality cannot be imposed from without. It must be chosen. The freedom to choose one's spirituality is a precondition to the genuine adoption of any spirituality. Such freedom, also, is precisely what is held sacrosanct in the political philosophy of liberalism. By not imposing a specific spirituality, thus, liberalism makes genuine spirituality possible. It is significant to note that when the Declaration of Independence declares all men have been endowed by their creator with certain inalienable rights, it is not simply stating an arbitrary preference for those rights, it is making a metaphysical claim. Freedom of choice is not first of all a political 'right' granted by the state; it is first of all an ontological fact. Human beings are endowed with the freedom to choose as part of their essential nature, whether or not political institutions respect this freedom. Liberalism does not create freedom, it merely protects it. From a theistic perspective, then, freedom of choice must be seen as God's creation, and liberalism, the political philosophy dedicated to its preservation, as honoring the will of God."


    So do those who read agree?
    "Liberalism does not create freedom, it merely protects it. From a theistic perspective, then, freedom of choice must be seen as God's creation, and liberalism, the political philosophy dedicated to its preservation, as honoring the will of God."

    Well, then, God is not liberal. God is the Creator, liberalism (classical) a protector of liberty of conscience--modern liberty an offender.
    Tradition is not the worship of ashes, but the preservation of fire. ― Gustav Mahler

  7. #26
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    Quote Originally Posted by midcan5 View Post
    More childish, no, you are.... Mister D can't answer a previous question of mine so he whines on. Sad.


    @midcan5 First you tell me you're waiting for a personal message I was supposed to send. Now I won't answer a question you claim to have asked. Are you OK? lol

    Hmmm...let's see.

    "But such inner spirituality cannot be imposed from without. It must be chosen. The freedom to choose one's spirituality is a precondition to the genuine adoption of any spirituality.
    Agree. Such musings go back at least to Tertullian in the early 3rd Century.

    Such freedom, also, is precisely what is held sacrosanct in the political philosophy of liberalism.
    Can liberal ideology be reduced to liberty of conscience? One would then miss the overall impact of liberalism on religion.

    By not imposing a specific spirituality, thus, liberalism makes genuine spirituality possible.
    So, there was no "genuine" spirituality prior to the 17th Century? Does anyone actually believe this? We agree that spirituality cannot be imposed. Liberals discovered this? This was recognized 1400 years before there was such a creature. Not sure what to make of this statement.
    It is significant to note that when the Declaration of Independence declares all men have been endowed by their creator with certain inalienable rights, it is not simply stating an arbitrary preference for those rights, it is making a metaphysical claim. Freedom of choice is not first of all a political 'right' granted by the state; it is first of all an ontological fact. Human beings are endowed with the freedom to choose as part of their essential nature, whether or not political institutions respect this freedom.
    Agreed. Our atheists have a difficult time wrapping their minds around that but I digress.

    Liberalism does not create freedom, it merely protects it. From a theistic perspective, then, freedom of choice must be seen as God's creation, and liberalism, the political philosophy dedicated to its preservation, as honoring the will of God."
    As Hanger remarked earlier, there seems to be some confusion on your part regarding the term liberal. Think Locke, not AOC. lol Anyway, so the conclusion is that respecting liberty of conscience is honoring God's will? Is that all?
    Whoever criticizes capitalism, while approving immigration, whose working class is its first victim, had better shut up. Whoever criticizes immigration, while remaining silent about capitalism, should do the same.


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    If someone pictures God as the God of the Old Testament - urging his people on to conquer and slay in his name and seize others' land by force of arms, to focus on and adhere to the letter of the law, rather than the spirit, and that certain groups are destined to rule and that life consists of "every man for himself" - then they're picturing God as a conservative.

    If, on the other hand, they're picturing God as Jesus Christ, teaching about how it is God's will that we feed the hungry, visit the prisoner, welcome the stranger and in general to treat every individual with compassion, then they are picturing God as a liberal.
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    lol
    Whoever criticizes capitalism, while approving immigration, whose working class is its first victim, had better shut up. Whoever criticizes immigration, while remaining silent about capitalism, should do the same.


    ~Alain de Benoist


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    Quote Originally Posted by hanger4 View Post
    *"The only thing that stops God from sending another flood is that the first one was useless." Nicolas Chamfort*

    Mr. Chamfort is was wrong;

    Genesis 9:14-16

    14 Whenever I bring clouds over the earth and the rainbow appears in the clouds, 15 I will remember my covenant between me and you and all living creatures of every kind. Never again will the waters become a flood to destroy all life. 16 Whenever the rainbow appears in the clouds, I will see it and remember the everlasting covenant between God and all living creatures of every kind on the earth.”

    Find some new sources.

    Now run away midcan5, it's what you do so well.
    I do not believe there is any evidence for a worldwide flood that killed all life.
    Call your state legislators and insist they approve the Article V convention of States to propose amendments.


    I pledge allegiance to the Constitution as written and understood by this nation's founders, and to the Republic it created, an indivisible union of sovereign States, with liberty and justice for all.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Mister D View Post
    So what?

    What does this mean? What are you trying to say? There is no right way to live? There is no good? There is no evil? What do you mean? It's unclear. What is this "instruction manual?" What are you talking about?
    There may not be one right way to live. I believe there are many right ways.
    Call your state legislators and insist they approve the Article V convention of States to propose amendments.


    I pledge allegiance to the Constitution as written and understood by this nation's founders, and to the Republic it created, an indivisible union of sovereign States, with liberty and justice for all.

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