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Thread: Can there be a revolution anymore?

  1. #31
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    MisterVeritis's Avatar Senior Member
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    Quote Originally Posted by Metal God View Post
    In this nuclear age imagine you’re living in China or Russia and you want to fight for independence. How would you go about it? Do you go braveheart and just start killing all the guards with your community hoping it catches on enough with the broader country? Obviously peacefully protesting gets you nowhere when dealing with an iron fist. That just gets you poisoned and then sent to jail if you survive and return to the country.
    Imagine living in the United States under the growing oppressive clouds. Imagine choosing to fight for independence or to claim control of the nation. How would American citizens fight for their liberty? We would begin by watching Stephen K. Bannon's War Room twice each day.
    Call your state legislators and insist they approve the Article V convention of States to propose amendments.


    I pledge allegiance to the Constitution as written and understood by this nation's founders, and to the Republic it created, an indivisible union of sovereign States, with liberty and justice for all.

  2. #32
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    Metal God's Avatar Senior Member
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    Quote Originally Posted by blackjack21 View Post
    China just went through a bunch of power outages affecting businesses and the citizenry. While it hasn't had any obvious revolutionary effects, the government of China acts increasingly hostile toward Taiwan--probably the external enemy is held out to maintain internal cohesion. This suggests a serious lack of internal cohesion.

    Lots of anti-imperial revolutions have also taken place. India won its independence from the United Kingdom. While India's independence was at least rhetorically embracing non-violence, Ireland won its independence and used violent means and terrorism, particularly when the United Kingdom had bigger fish to fry during WWI and WWII.

    Algeria won independence from France when France had nuclear weapons. Watch the movie "The Battle of Algiers." It's old school, but it gives you a good idea of what that type of conflict looks like.

    I think Metal God's subordination of this to a "nuclear age", as though that precluded resistance, is kind of a big flaw in establishment thinking. I've even heard American politicians saying this, like Joe Biden and Eric Swalwell. The idea that nuclear weapons have any utility in a revolutionary context is bizarre to me.

    Biden mentioned F-15s and nuclear weapons in reference to 1/6. What would you do in the case of 1/6? Drop nuclear weapons on the Capitol to nuke the protesters? You'd kill every Congressman, Senator, and the sitting Vice President, probably the sitting president, and the entire Supreme Court if it were in session. Does that sound like a militarily sound response?

    I get that Metal God is a bit of a parrot of Democrat party rhetoric, but I find it baffling that people actually think nuclear weapons have a great deal of utility outside of their context in WWII--that is, the enemy shoots down 25% of your bombers on every bombing run, and you're lucky if you hit 20% of your targets, but you are desperate to destroy their war-making capability. So you drop one massive bomb on an area you want to destroy, and that solves your problem--however, it creates many more: 1) a nuclear arms race; 2) an ethical dilemma that you kill far more non-combatants than morally necessary; 3) you leave nuclear fallout that long outlasts your military objective; 4) you introduce the possibility of nuclear annihilation--to name a few.

    What pray tell would make a nuclear weapon useful during civil unrest? Even Saddam Hussein was reported to have used VX nerve agent, which killed people and livestock, but left infrastructure in place.

    Police forces could use live ammunition against protesters, but rarely do. Why? It increases the outrage. So they use non-lethal weapons like rubber bullets, bean bags, tear gas, water cannons, etc., which also tends to piss people off, but not enough to generate the outrage that leads to overthrow of the government.

    I think you are correct that working from within would be the approach, but that's also scary. Think of Pakistan. It's government, including the ISI, is full of Taliban sympathizers. What if the Taliban types take over the government and gain control of nuclear weapons? That's where I think you could see a situation where nuclear weapons might get used on civilian "infidel" populations in big cities. Otherwise, I just don't see them has having any real utility. They're just a nihilists wet dream at this point.
    I don’t mean to say nuclear weapons play a part in the revolution I’m talking about. It’s just something I’m using to describe how powerful and advanced a country is. And if there weren’t nuclear weapons on the table we might’ve gone to direct war with one of these countries already for their atrocities they’ve committed through the years. Might’ve won and they might’ve been freed.
    Last edited by Metal God; 11-29-2021 at 01:32 PM.

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    carolina73's Avatar Senior Member
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    In modern days the revolutions are not fought by band of resistors. They take large turnouts of people of the country marching against the government. Then portions of the military fall in line with the populace.

    That is why Biden is trying to cleanse the military right know and promote liberal training. He knows the military is 85% conservative. He has put obedient little fruitcakes in charge. Little General Milley and Biden's team will fall on which ever side is good for themselves.
    Let's go Brandon !!!

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    slackercruster's Avatar Senior Member
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    Quote Originally Posted by Metal God View Post
    In this nuclear age imagine you’re living in China or Russia and you want to fight for independence. How would you go about it? Do you go braveheart and just start killing all the guards with your community hoping it catches on enough with the broader country? Obviously peacefully protesting gets you nowhere when dealing with an iron fist. That just gets you poisoned and then sent to jail if you survive and return to the country.
    In the USA, no revolution because the reps are not organized. The dems are highly organized and well-funded. Their revolts of sorts are pretty successful. Best reps can hope for is secession. They are no competition for the dems.

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