Russia’s Protracted War in Ukraine

[carolina73]

This war would likely be over now--with the Crimea and Donbas formally separating from Ukraine--had the West not flooded Ukraine with weapons and money.

Other than the oligarchs that will absorb a good deal of the "aid" sent to Ukraine, there are no winners.

Unless the Crimea and Donbas can eventually separate with international recognition. In that case, those two regions would probably consider themselves winners.

But, if Russia loses--they lose, too. And then the status quo of in-fighting and dying will continue in the Donbas.

Some are looking at this situation as Russia gaining a stronghold. I don't see it that way. And Ukraine is incredibly corrupt, so I'm not a fan of helping dig them out of a hole they dug for themselves.

But, Biden is throwing caution to the wind. We could still see ourselves embroiled in a war that isn't any of our business.

You know that for a fact or you are just guessing?
What stops him for asking for more in another 7 years?

Appeasement = justice and a sound foreign policy for Ukraine?
Putin will see weakness as a sign he better stay away?

The easy way out is seldom the right way out.

[FindersKeepers]

You know that for a fact or you are just guessing?
What stops him for asking for more in another 7 years?

What stops anyone from asking for more?
What stops Israel from deciding to annex more of the disputed land?

Appeasement = justice and a sound foreign policy for Ukraine?
Putin will see weakness as a sign he better stay away?

We've been appeasing Zelensky since the beginning of this fracas. Since before that, actually, but most of the world thinks Zelensky was born the day Russia invaded Ukraine. They don't realize he had a long and sordid past before that.

The bottom line is that we shouldn't be messing around in a war where one corrupt country invades another corrupt country. Our responsibility lies in not taking a position that escalates the war into something much larger.

It's okay to take sides, and it's okay to point fingers. What's not okay is turning a regional war into our proxy war by pumping massive amounts of money and munitions into one of the two corrupt countries.

The easy way out is seldom the right way out.

The only "right" way is way that leads to peace the soonest with the fewest possible casualties.

Keep an eye on Zaporizhzhia--the nuclear power plant in occupied eastern Ukraine that Russia is currently using as a base for their military.

Russia was able to take that region without damaging the nuclear plant--what are the odds they'd want to damage it now that they're in control of it?

[carolina73]

What stops anyone from asking for more?
What stops Israel from deciding to annex more of the disputed land?




We've been appeasing Zelensky since the beginning of this fracas. Since before that, actually, but most of the world thinks Zelensky was born the day Russia invaded Ukraine. They don't realize he had a long and sordid past before that.

The bottom line is that we shouldn't be messing around in a war where one corrupt country invades another corrupt country. Our responsibility lies in not taking a position that escalates the war into something much larger.

It's okay to take sides, and it's okay to point fingers. What's not okay is turning a regional war into our proxy war by pumping massive amounts of money and munitions into one of the two corrupt countries.



The only "right" way is way that leads to peace the soonest with the fewest possible casualties.

Keep an eye on Zaporizhzhia--the nuclear power plant in occupied eastern Ukraine that Russia is currently using as a base for their military.

Russia was able to take that region without damaging the nuclear plant--what are the odds they'd want to damage it now that they're in control of it?

You would have been a Tory in the American Revolution?
The UK should have made a treaty in WWII to give Germany mainland Europe?

I still do not buy your motivation of just wanting to save lives. You have far too much hatred for Zelensky and the people of Ukraine. This is personal for you.

[Peter1469]

This war is looking like a stalemate at this point. How much longer can they maintain this?

Until one side realizes that they can't go on; make not future gains.

[Tahuyaman]

Until one side realizes that they can't go on; make not future gains.

This is simply a war of attrition.

[Tahuyaman]

…most of the world thinks Zelensky was born the day Russia invaded Ukraine. They don't realize he had a long and sordid past before that….

What kind of “long and sordid past?” He was a comedian.

[FindersKeepers]

You would have been a Tory in the American Revolution?
The UK should have made a treaty in WWII to give Germany mainland Europe?

I still do not buy your motivation of just wanting to save lives. You have far too much hatred for Zelensky and the people of Ukraine. This is personal for you.

Baloney.

Criticism of Zelensky is based on his history. Nothing more.

I just don't like the US getting involved and putting the world at risk for such a corrupt nation.

I'm tired of seeing Zelensky in his stretched out, sweaty green shirt. Gross. His handlers think it makes him look tough. Realistically, he just looks like he probably smells bad.

You're backing a corrupt leader who is in bed with Igor Kholomoisky.

You're also in firm agreement with this guy...

https://twitter.com/AVindman?ref_src...Ctwgr%5Eauthor

[Peter1469]

This is simply a war of attrition.

And one side will win it. So long as Russia doesn't over extend itself, the war favors them.

[Peter1469]

I think nobody at this point. Do I think that Ukraine can capture its lost territory? No. Do I think that Russia can take much more of it? No.


Who is Winning the Russo-Ukrainian War?

What’s happening in the nearly six-month-old Russo-Ukrainian war? It’s hard to say. Moscow expected a proverbial cakewalk and bungled its initial attack. After rebuffing Russia’s assault, the Zelensky government expanded its objectives, expressing its desire to reconquer portions of the Donbas seized by separatists with Russian support in 2014, as well as Crimea, which had been formally annexed by Moscow.

In recent months, however, Russian forces have made slow progress in the Donbas and now occupy a fifth or more of Ukrainian territory. But Ukraine and its advocates have been threatening counteroffensives against Moscow’s supposedly overstretched forces. Conflicting claims have been made about casualty levels, the impact of high-tech allied weapons sent to Ukraine, and both sides' prospects in the war.

***

The agreement among Washington and European capitals seems to be that Kiev will decide how long to fight and for what objective, that nothing will be decided about Ukraine without Ukraine in the room, and that whatever Kiev believes to be necessary will be provided by the U.S. and Europe.

***

To set policy, Washington officials need the best information possible. Sympathy toward Ukraine, though warranted, should not blind the U.S. and others to the reality of the conflict. For instance, news sources favorable toward Moscow have been shut down throughout the West. Twitter has treated Russo-friendly posters as if they were regime propagandists and banned them. While it would be foolish to rely on such sources, it makes no more sense to bias the entire information ecosystem toward Kiev.

[DGUtley]

Your last paragraph is spot on.