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Thread: The fate of Free Speech will be decided soon.

  1. #11
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    Standing Wolf's Avatar Senior Member
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    Quote Originally Posted by CCitizen View Post
    Sadly, Progressives are trying to make sure that no Internet Providers are available to host sites which allow disagreement with them. They tried very hard to deplatform Gab and Parler. If they succeed, then no criticism of their ideology will be accessible online. That will be Totalitarian Dystopia.
    CC, I'm not trying to be mean or insulting, but if you're either not going to make an honest attempt to understand what I'm saying or you're unable to do so, I'm not going to waste any more time attempting to get you to see my points.

    EDIT: Okay, I'm going to try once more. I'm sure you know better than to believe that social media sites are the only source of information or opinion on the Internet. So why would you make the clearly erroneous claim that a "Totalitarian Dystopia" will result unless everyone is entitled to post whatever they want to on social media? You're on a forum right now on which some batsh*t crazy stuff gets posted on a regular basis, and there are thousands (tens of thousands?) of similar message boards in existence. I'm sure there are a lot of 15-year-old girls out there who believe that social media sites are their only means of communicating with the world, but as grownups we know better. Right?
    Last edited by Standing Wolf; 10-27-2022 at 03:49 PM.
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  2. #12
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    LescoBrandon's Avatar Senior Member
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    Quote Originally Posted by Standing Wolf View Post
    If Elon Musk purchases a controlling interest in Twitter, a privately-owned social media platform, he will be free to operate it as he sees fit - just as are its current owners. He will be free to promote and encourage, and to sanction and restrict, any comments he wants to - just as are its current owners. If he chooses to let anyone say anything on his platform that it is legal to publicly say, that will be his prerogative.

    Freedom, more precisely freedom of speech, has nothing whatsoever to do with it.

    Should Musk get tired of playing with Twitter five or ten years down the road and sells it to some individual or group that elects to restrict what they consider to be "left wing" speech, again - no one's "freedom" is affected. The freedom to use someone else's property to recruit, lecture or proselytize, or even just to make statements that are counter to what the owner believes or supports, does not exist.
    Free speech has everything to do with it when government outsources the violation of civil rights to privately-owned companies, which evidence now exists that's exactly what the government has been doing. The government can't skirt the first amendment by outsourcing civil rights violations to contractors.

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    Omar (10-28-2022)

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    carolina73's Avatar Senior Member
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    Quote Originally Posted by Standing Wolf View Post
    If Elon Musk purchases a controlling interest in Twitter, a privately-owned social media platform, he will be free to operate it as he sees fit - just as are its current owners. He will be free to promote and encourage, and to sanction and restrict, any comments he wants to - just as are its current owners. If he chooses to let anyone say anything on his platform that it is legal to publicly say, that will be his prerogative.

    Freedom, more precisely freedom of speech, has nothing whatsoever to do with it.

    Should Musk get tired of playing with Twitter five or ten years down the road and sells it to some individual or group that elects to restrict what they consider to be "left wing" speech, again - no one's "freedom" is affected. The freedom to use someone else's property to recruit, lecture or proselytize, or even just to make statements that are counter to what the owner believes or supports, does not exist.
    The US is only 1/4 of Twitter users. Probably less if they subtracted the bots. It is a way the world communicates openly while the US right is politically silenced.

    It can make a huge difference despite what your feelings are.

    The only question is will the left stop using Twitter because they will no longer ban the conservative voices. A typical leftist pout-fest.
    You being from the left do not feel restricted, because the left owns all major communications in the USA all the way to the phone companies. For conservatives Twitter may be the first large public forum we can share in.
    Let's go Brandon !!!

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    CCitizen (10-27-2022)

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    CCitizen's Avatar Senior Member
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    Quote Originally Posted by Standing Wolf View Post
    CC, I'm not trying to be mean or insulting, but if you're either not going to make an honest attempt to understand what I'm saying or you're unable to do so, I'm not going to waste any more time attempting to get you to see my points.

    EDIT: Okay, I'm going to try once more. I'm sure you know better than to believe that social media sites are the only source of information or opinion on the Internet. So why would you make the clearly erroneous claim that a "Totalitarian Dystopia" will result unless everyone is entitled to post whatever they want to on social media? You're on a forum right now on which some batsh*t crazy stuff gets posted on a regular basis, and there are thousands (tens of thousands?) of similar message boards in existence. I'm sure there are a lot of 15-year-old girls out there who believe that social media sites are their only means of communicating with the world, but as grownups we know better. Right?
    I am sorry.

    If Progressives succeed, then all websites and forums which are critical of them or sites and forums allowing material critical of Progressives will be banned. If Progressives succeed, then no information or opinions critical of them will be allowed on the Internet. Not just Social Media, but the whole Internet. That will be Totalitarian Dystopia.


    Progressives tried very hard to deplatform websites such as Parler, Gab, and $#@!ute. Fortunately, these sites survived. But Freedom can not be taken for granted.
    Progressives are Passionate about establishing Totalitarian Tyranny.

    Conservatives are Apathetic about maintaining a Free Society.

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    CCitizen's Avatar Senior Member
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    Quote Originally Posted by carolina73 View Post
    You being from the left do not feel restricted, because the left owns all major communications in the USA all the way to the phone companies. For conservatives Twitter may be the first large public forum we can share in.
    Not only for Conservatives, but also for many other parties.

    One of the worst and earliest examples of censorship was media censorship of facts about gender discrimination toward men. That censorship is described in Warren Farrell's book "Women Can't Hear What Men Don't Say". Censorship of men's issues started in 1978. Censorship of mainstream Conservatives started only in about 2016.
    Progressives are Passionate about establishing Totalitarian Tyranny.

    Conservatives are Apathetic about maintaining a Free Society.

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    Censorship started out small in 1978. By 2021, the President of the United States was banned by all Social Media networks.
    Progressives are Passionate about establishing Totalitarian Tyranny.

    Conservatives are Apathetic about maintaining a Free Society.

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    Chris's Avatar Senior Member
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    I agree, the tendency is for non-Progressive, or, better, non-Woke views to be shunned if not silenced in social media and news media.

    Not sure Musk can change that as bottomline, his, is likely profits.

    Can a Rep midterm win change things? Likely not much. Much of their agenda will be to try and prevent further spread of Woke agendas but all they can control is legislation. The administration is still under Biden. And political power, much of it in the grasp of big media, big tech, big banks, tends to serve economic growth, that is, now, the Woke marketplace, not the people.
    Tradition is not the worship of ashes, but the preservation of fire. ― Gustav Mahler

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    Omar's Avatar Senior Member
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    Quote Originally Posted by Chris View Post
    Can a Rep midterm win change things? Likely not much
    This is what I've been thinking. Biden isn't going to sign any Republican bills, and unless the Republicans take both Houses, the Senate isn't going to put any forward either. So what powers does the House have that they can do on their own? I know they can impeach (but not convict). They can hold commissions. They probably won't have the DOJ as their lapdog like the Dems do though.
    "Look into my eyes - I guarantee you - I guarantee you we are going to end fossil fuels" - Joe Biden

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    Standing Wolf's Avatar Senior Member
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    Quote Originally Posted by LescoBrandon View Post
    Free speech has everything to do with it when government outsources the violation of civil rights to privately-owned companies, which evidence now exists that's exactly what the government has been doing. The government can't skirt the first amendment by outsourcing civil rights violations to contractors.
    An organization that many on the Right love to hate - but which, ironically, is on their side more often than the Right will admit - agrees with you.

    https://www.aclusocal.org/en/know-yo...dia-censorship

    https://www.nyclu.org/en/know-your-r...s-social-media
    Civilized men are more discourteous than savages because they know they can be impolite without having their skulls split, as a general thing.” - Robert E. Howard

    "Only a rank degenerate would drive 1,500 miles across Texas and not eat a chicken fried steak." - Larry McMurtry

  12. #20
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    LescoBrandon's Avatar Senior Member
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    Quote Originally Posted by Standing Wolf View Post
    An organization that many on the Right love to hate - but which, ironically, is on their side more often than the Right will admit - agrees with you.

    https://www.aclusocal.org/en/know-yo...dia-censorship

    https://www.nyclu.org/en/know-your-r...s-social-media
    While both of those are useful pages, which I agree with, they're not really on point to my post.

    Let me provide an example.... CDC personnel cannot infringe upon free speech. But, they take a plane out to Facebook's headquarters and have a meeting, urging Facebook to ban, censor, or label posts that criticize the mask mandates or vaccines.
    Or another example... the FBI calls up Facebook and gets them to ban articles about Hunter Biden's laptop.

    Both of these are examples of the federal government outsourcing the censoring of free speech, which is patently illegal.

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