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Thread: Is Judaism a Younger Religion Than Previously Thought?

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    LescoBrandon's Avatar Senior Member
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    I'd like to see a better argument from the source in the OP. First, we know from the Old Testament that there were numerous periods of time where the Israelites worshipped false gods, or made images, etc. If you're using that as an argument to say that "therefore Judaism didn't emerge until 100BC", it's a pretty poor argument. It seems like a lot of "absence of evidence is evidence of absence" too, with respect to the baths and washing traditions.

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    Quote Originally Posted by LescoBrandon View Post
    I'd like to see a better argument from the source in the OP. First, we know from the Old Testament that there were numerous periods of time where the Israelites worshipped false gods, or made images, etc. If you're using that as an argument to say that "therefore Judaism didn't emerge until 100BC", it's a pretty poor argument. It seems like a lot of "absence of evidence is evidence of absence" too, with respect to the baths and washing traditions.
    So far I've found he's Jewish teaching at a university in Israel. He's looking at the archeological record.
    Tradition is not the worship of ashes, but the preservation of fire. ― Gustav Mahler

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    Take this argument, for example, found in the article:

    Adler cites passages in biblical books to back up his assertion: In Nehemiah, for instance, the titular narrator complains about Judeans blatantly ignoring religious leaders’ strictures regarding the Sabbath. “The masses,” says Adler, “were not heeding their call.” He adds, “If anyone would like to argue that the general populace knew of any kind of Sabbath prohibitions, the burden of evidence lies firmly on his or her shoulders to show that this was the case.”


    This is not a very good argument on his part. It's like saying that because so many people on the highway frequently speed, there are no legal speed limits that anyone knows about.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Chris View Post
    So far I've found he's Jewish teaching at a university in Israel. He's looking at the archeological record.
    Which is often very limited especially where written text are concerned. Then along comes a great find like the Dead Sea Scrolls.
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    Quote Originally Posted by LescoBrandon View Post
    I don't think Judaism is younger than previously taught, but certainly some of the ritualistic traditions may have become widely practiced or even required later on.

    I think making the claim that Judaism is younger than thought is stretching his evidence a bit too far. Or making too vague a conclusion, which is what often happens to generate interest...

    They just found a Hebrew "curse tablet" from circa 1200BC.





    And we see the same thing in the early variations and formation of Christianity before that became and fully organized religion. But to suggest it did not exists during the time of Christ or soon after would be absurd.
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    The earliest "discovered" part of the Torah is a piece of a silver scroll that contains part of the Book of Numbers, and dates to around 600-700BC.

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    Quote Originally Posted by RMNIXON View Post
    Which is often very limited especially where written text are concerned. Then along comes a great find like the Dead Sea Scrolls.
    But what else have you got?
    Tradition is not the worship of ashes, but the preservation of fire. ― Gustav Mahler

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    His claim is specifically "that ordinary Judeans didn’t consistently celebrate Passover, hold the Sabbath sacred or practice other traditional forms of Jewish ritual until a century or so before the birth of Jesus."

    He's saying Judaism didn't become established among the people until later than commonly thought.
    Tradition is not the worship of ashes, but the preservation of fire. ― Gustav Mahler

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    Quote Originally Posted by Chris View Post
    But what else have you got?
    As others have mentioned, the failure of the Israelites to abide by the covenant with Yahweh is a major theme of the Jewish Bible. The bible is replete with instances of public practices anathema to the cult of Yahweh. I'm sure there must be more to his argument but at first glance I don't see what's so controversial or new about it.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Chris View Post
    His claim is specifically "that ordinary Judeans didn’t consistently celebrate Passover, hold the Sabbath sacred or practice other traditional forms of Jewish ritual until a century or so before the birth of Jesus."

    He's saying Judaism didn't become established among the people until later than commonly thought.
    Ah, I see.
    Whoever criticizes capitalism, while approving immigration, whose working class is its first victim, had better shut up. Whoever criticizes immigration, while remaining silent about capitalism, should do the same.


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